Code,990016
Subject,Kermit J. Lind
Date,6/10/2013
Interviewer,Bethany Hollowell
Abstract,"Lind grew up in Kansas and, after college, attended graduate school at the University of Chicago.  He taught at Cleveland State University and lived first on Cleveland's near east side, then in Euclid before choosing Coventry Village in Cleveland Heights as an escape from the racial intolerance he felt characterized Cleveland's suburbs in the early 1970s.  Lind became active in testing compliance with fair housing laws and returned to school to earn a degree in law.  In 1977 he assumed the directorship of the Cuyahoga Plan, a fair housing organization committed to eliminating racial steering in suburban Cleveland.  Most of the interview explores the shifting contours of housing discrimination and efforts to ameliorate it."
Tags,"Cuyahoga Plan, African Americans, Heights Community Congress, Fair Housing Act 1968, Cleveland State University, Euclid, racism, Cleveland Heights, Coventry Road, Tommy's, See-Saw Cafe, Coventry Neighbors, Data-Based research for Integration, Oak Park IL, Heights Housing Service"
Special Notes,
minutes:,
0,Lind grew up in a very small town in central Kansas; his father was a teacher and ordained minister at a college
1,"The community was agricultural, then went to college in northern Indiana at Goshen College, then worked on a Ph.D. in European history at the University of Chicago"
2,"Heard about an opening in the CSU History Dept., got the job, and moved two weeks after the interview. He moved to Euclid Ave. and 40th"
3,"Downtown at the time was beginning to get pretty ""ragged""... recalls seeing a fight outside his apartment at a vacant restaurant, so in the Spring he moved to Euclid"
4,"Lind was very campus oriented, went to little stores down the street to his apartment. He didn't have a car."
5,Apartment in Euclid: was occupied by people who had modest incomes
6,It wasn't the same kind of people he hung out with: He couldn't really connect with the crowd in Euclid
7,Started teaching evening classes after his first year teaching for branches of CSU
8,"It was somewhat ""embarassing"" to him to hear the racist remarks from his neighbors in Euclid, he realized that he couldn't invite colleagues of color to his home."
9,The people he'd converse with in Euclid were blatantly racist
10,"1970, 1971; the Hough riots were raw memories at this point in time, so there was a level of fear and disdain... there was a latent fear in Euclid that because of the low cost of housing, they felt the pressure of African Americans moving into their community"
11,They were very up-front in saying they didn't want blacks in their community
12,Euclid was extremely unwelcoming and discriminatory. He moved to a small apt. on Coventry Road in Cleveland Heights
13,"Living in Coventry was a bit more expensive, but the location was a big amenity upgrade. He went to Tommy's frequently, Mitchell's Candies"
14,"Coventry was emerging as the ""Cool, in-place"" to hang out, the See-Saw Cafe was popular ""notorious"".."
15,Entrepenuers wanted to cater to that culture that came to Coventry Road in the 70's.
16,"Early on he fell into a group called ""Coventry Neighbors"" an interesting exposure to basic civic affairs like landlord-tenant issues"
17,"it was a progressive, interracial group of younger people. Around that time his tenure had ended at CSU"
18,He took a new path in interests and career path
19,"From the work in Coventry Neighbors in 1974, there was a movement of activity towards residential integration. The first task force he worked with was the Landlord-Tenant Task Force 1974 state of Ohio enacted first landlord-tenant statute so,"
20,they clarified exactly what those relationships between landlord and tenant should be. 1976: became Executive Director of Heights Community Congress
21,"At that time, he was involved in legal issues: Whethers v. Peters reality a fair housing case.. Participated in a ""test"" for an apartment in the Cedar/Fairmount Area"
22,"Dorothy Whethers had sought an apartment there and was denied, suspected it was due to reasons of her race. Then one of  her friends (white) then applied and was instantly accepted. The white couple said they had decided on another apartment and cancelled their interest in the apartment."
23,"Six hours after they cancelled, Lind called to ""test"" if he'd be accepted to see the apartment and it was offered to him, and Dorothy Wethers had called again to see if there was anything available she was told ""no"" there was not  ..They took the case to the federal court"
24,The appeal of the Case was heard and decided favorably for Dorothy Weathers. It was perhaps one of the first cases litigated in the area after the fair housing act of 1968
25,In 1977 after one year at the Heights Community Congress he was encouraged to apply for a position as executive director for an org. called the Cuyahoga Plan: formed in 1974 as an advocacy organization for fair/integrated housing.
26,Applied to Law school
27,Cleveland State's Law School provided a good part time education
28,Took an assignment as director of the citizens league which advocated good gov't. So he entered law
29,The Cuyahoga Plan: Proponents of Integration ...
30,Arose as a response of the turmoil of the 1960's..had a good reaction from well-educated folks from colleges and universities...Integration was held by that minority of folks...Mostly interested in the East Side
31,"There were small movements in Shaker Heights, Cleveland Heights that joined because of mutual concern with integration"
32,"Organizations encouraged white families to essentially ""stay"" and embrace integration"
33,"A couty-wide effort: Recieved a grant to follow through with the Cuyahoga Plan: designed as an entity to work with the etablishment: included big business folks, realitors, bankers"
34,"some where personally committed, some where concerned about their institutions interests"
35,His appointment to the Cuyahoga Plan was particularly controversial becuase Lind was white
36,"Because of the controversy there was open opposition after his appointment, the controversy around integration rose from the fact that in the Heights area, ""the key to succesful integration required white people, who had the option to move, to not do so, to embrace and accept racial diversity on their street"""
37,"East Cleveland was an example of the white flight, the school went from almost 100 percent white to black in just a few years"
38,"The focus was not only on getting white families to stay, but to also encourage white families to move into integrated areas."
39,"African Americans were ""certainly"" not going to the West Side...  this issue of lack of space created a palpable threat"
40,"Some of the big businesspeople were involved in the Cuyahoga Plan for religious reasons; others saw, legally under the constitution, integration had to come about"
41,"Some, from a business point of view, saw that fighting against integration had a reputational consequences that aren't good.. some would say ""look, we're going to look like idiots ten years from now if we don't see this train is on the track"""
42,"Cuyahoga Plan: 3 major programatic areas: 1: the monitoring and enforcement of fair housing policies so that, for instance, looking at block grant funds and how they were spent by local municipalities."
43,some litigation was brought to the city of Euclid for misusing those funds
44,They were more directly involved by litigation provided by Heights community Congress: Cleveland Heights vs. Hilltop (testing similar to what he was involved in w/ dorothy whethers)
45,"sought places that helped minorities to find housing,"
46,"2: Assisted minority house-seekers not only to the east side, but to the west side as well, to defy the stereotype that minorities shouldn't live on the west side"
47,3: this program emerged from advocacy oriented research: Used Data and Research in order to communicate more effectively and more accurately what the reality of racial diversity meant
48,Bruce Melville : a technique was conducted to measure racial diversity to areas based off of the birth/death records/census tract
49,"They published the data on a Map: with the goal to expose the reality, that racial diversity was not accompanied by disaster"
50,"Materials began showing up on the tables in business partners offices, then recieved help from an advertising firm..aligned with the real estate business"
51,"Engaged in these 3, also assisted in organizational entities in Bedford Heights,"
52,provided community organization structure to the Bedford Heights Area... The Cuyahoga Plan was forced to make some changes after grants were cut .... and then they realized they could recieve that same money the munipalities recieved for block granting:
53,There was some discomfort
54,People thought they were going to just give black people money to live in the neighborhoods in order to integrate them: East side suburbs didn't have any problems....Parma refused to accept millions of dollars in Community Development Block Grant grant funds  
55,"1983: Parma, as a result of a fair housing lawsuit, ended up with a settlement which connected them, by contract, to the Cuyahoga Plan. So Lind had to give educational seminars to Parma"
56,The lawsuit of Cleveland Heights: The pushback towards integration: Smith v. City of Cleveland Heights.
57,a black man said that the two associations were depriving him of having any black neighbors (b/c they advocated white people to stay)
58,"He wrote an article in law school about integration: affirmative action in housing is not a very clear concept, to what extend can govt achieve integration?"
59,"It's difficult to move people from their comfort zones, when trying to integrate a community"
60,What is integration? is it 50/50? then how do you account for a nation whose population is entirely 15 percent..its not a debate that's easily concluded
61,Cleveland Heights spent public dollars to assist people of any race looking to purchase housing: aimed towards white people.
62,"you wouldnt be turned away if you were af. american, but your race would be taken into account in regards to where you were shown availabilty around town."
63,Realitors would tell people about percentages of minorities at elementary schools: to alarm people from a racial diversity point of view..
64,That was really what caused law suit towards cleveland heights....
65,"Suburbs south of chicago, there were places all over the country where the same type of things were being done : Ex. Oak Park situation"
66,implied a soon-to be racial change in the town. The city of Clvd heights used policy to reinforce racial stability: Between point of sale and exterior/anterior inspection you were unable to change the value of the house...
67,these types of policies secured and enhanced the quality of life
68,"recreation was an investment in the heights community, represented black and white people doing things together: Street fairs"
69,Heights community org created some recreational activities...
70,"Heights Housing Service which now is operated by the city hall, was originated by the Heights Community Congress"
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