Code,990020
Subject,James L. Jones
Date,6/18/2013
Interviewer,Leslie A. Jones
Abstract,"James L. Jones, aka ""Buddy"" Jones, was born in Union Springs, Alabama, in 1912, the son of a sharecropper.  At age 7 the family moved to Matewan, West Virginia, for his father to work in the coalfields.  Trouble soon developed when his father became involved in the UMWA's effort to organize coal miners in the region.  Jones recalls being evicted from company housing and having to live in a tent.  Company-hired ""detectives"" fired upon the tents at night in the buildup to the infamous Matewan Massacre in 1921.  Jones later served in the US Army in Western Europe during World War II, where he first became aware of racial discrimination.  He tells a great story about being in Texas during his wartime military service and refusing to sit in the back of a military bus.  Jones also discusses his postwar migration to Cleveland, where he lived in Glenville and, later, East Cleveland.  He worked in ""heat treating"" metals at National Acme in Collinwood.  He also tells about supporting his friend George Forbes for city council and forming the Ghana Social Club, which operated in various bars and clubs in the early 1950s."
Tags,"African Americans, cotton ginning, Alabama, coal mining, West Virginia, Matewan WV, unions, United Mine Workers, World War II, England, France, Belgium, racial discrimination, Second Great Migration, Glenville, East Cleveland, black social clubs, National Acme, Collinwood"
Special Notes,"Les Jones (interviewee's son) prompted his father as needed; also present: Mark Souther (facilitator), Katherine Taylor (facilitator--developed list of questions, which Les Jones gave his father in advance), Belinda Jones (interviewee's daughter-in-law)."
minutes:,"Faint, intermittent, high-pitched sound is the interviewee's hearing aid; interviewee moves the mic repeatedly. Otherwise good sound."
0,"Born In August, 1912 where he was born on a farm in York Alabama. Father worked on the farm,"
1,"Rode on the wagon with his dad to take the Cotton to Selma, Alabama"
2,"When he was 7 his father gave him a goat, that he fixed to his little red wagon"
3,the goat wouldn't pull him around
4,1919 his father and mother planned to move from the cotton field to the coal field in Kentucky
5,"they had all these farm items, and recognized all the things were gone, and his father told James ""we're moving!"""
6,they were going to move to the mines where his father could make more money. He had never been in a car before until they moved
7,"his first ride in the car, the dirt road was bumpy"
8,then they caught a train in Chattanooga Tn. his first time seeing a train
9,they arrived in December .. and they had gotten there just before Christmas
10,"""Y'all better get to bed 'cause Santa Claus might be coming"" his mother said. Someone at the door knocked and asked ""Any bad boys in here?"" and to this day he still doesnt know who it was"
11,"his mother was a good cook , his dad worked but it didn't last long. Someone came and took their furniture"
12,His father had gotten fired from the coal mine for signing his name down to become part of a union. So they moved to a tent
13,"he recalls how the tent looked, boards down for the floor."
14,A whole down in the floor for the women and children to sleep
15,Recalls walking to school and fell into the water on the way to school.
16,"wrestled a boy a recess, and his sister told him to stop, but he didnt want to quit becuase he didnt want to lose again"
17,*screaching sound is from his hearing aid* ....James continues about his family
18,his mother passed away in 1920 he was only 9. She passed away a few days after giving birth. he noticed a lot of people were moving out of the tents
19,talks about the tent with the hole in the ground
20,"Blaire Mountain battle, WV a big ""shoot-out"" the union men got guns and killed the cheif or police"
21,"when his mother passed, they didn't know where their father went. So his oldest sister took them in, she was 10 yrs older than he."
22,"A lady told the kids that their dad had been taken to Jail, for having a gun."
23,after about 4 days his dad came home
24,"his father and some other guys built some little shacks, and they moved into those, not far from the tents. Then his dad went back to work into the coal mines."
25,He then started working on the saw mill.
26,"Moved to Redjacket, WV and went back to school."
27,He started working in a dry cleaning business on the weekend and the owner would give them a little change
28,"he was the tallest boy in school. the school house was on coal mine property, just a one room schoolhouse"
29,"They didn't have a high school, they only had to stay in school until the 8th grade. he stayed at the dry cleaing business $12 a week"
30,"That was in Matewan, WV"
31,the dry cleaner aske James to live with him so he could better show him the trade. and he cleaned up to do so and the manager didn't approve of his new clean clothes
32,"In Matewan he took him to the store and said ""fix him up"" so the guy at the clothing store brought him out long pants, dress pants"
33,"Then when he presented his new look the man said ""See thats the way you dress in business"""
34,"he went to work in the coal mines ""sneaked in the mines"" bc he wasnt seventeen yet."
35,his guy that he worked with was lazy. The boss recognized his lazy partner was using James to do all the work.
36,He wanted to work in the mines so that he could buy a car. his dad said go back to school i will buy you a car
37,"He went back to school and got good grades, he recieved some school work by mail.. dad bought him a model Nash"
38,"his friend had his sister come to town, and he wanted James to meet his sister."
39,On the way home from picking up his sister he got a flat tire. two boys drove by and didnt offer to help
40,The boys offered to take the girl but not the two boys. So his brother told his dad about what happened. And his dad got him the tools to fix a flat
41,"He made a vow to always buy good tires, because he missed his opportunity with the sister new in town. he was in the service before he left for cleveland"
42,he was sent over seas the same year he was in the service. He didn't know much about predjudice until the service.
43,"He never had a problem with race his parents never talked to him about it. The first time he experienced segregation, after he was inducted in the army"
44,"They gave him a pass to eat in the Army at Lousiville, KY."
45,A guy told one of the white guys he couldnt eat with the black guys in the cafeteria. When he asked him what the problem was .. he asked to talk to the manager. He showed the manager his special orders (copper?)
46,"he called the military police over (the manager) and he again showed his special orders, and they allowed everyone to eat together."
47,"The next incident, he went over seas"
48,"First they went to Gainsville, Texas. He rented a house and his wife came down there too"
49,"Then they were in Boston and they loaded onto the ship, headed overseas to England. He was older than most of the other soldiers"
50,"He didn't get promoted like he thought he would in England, there was 26 sergeants, most all were white."
51,"He had a promotion, is Whales, though it was taken back."
52,preps the story: Took a bus downtown and cued for a cab to go to a beer pub.
53,Someone used the N word to him when he tried to hail the cab.
54,"A white staff sergeant called him that, he hadn't been called it before. He hit the sergeant."
55,"They drug th sergeant away, and he was charged and went AWOL"
56,He drove a GMC truck..when he went to go get gas on base the guy at the gas station was the one he hit. Luckily he wasnt wearing the same clothes
57,military detials ..they stayed on a ship for 16days
58,"he ate all of his food except for the Spam, he didn't like spam."
59,They were near france on this boat.
60,*hits microphone*
61,then they went to Belgium..drove in the truck and the street was froze.
62,he hit a another truck on the road
63,When he got to belgium they were bombing the town upon his arrival.
64,*long pause* this is now in th Battle of the Bulge time period
65,"recalls hearing the shooting,"
66,"after a certain amount of days they returned to the station, the next day the allies sent planes over germany ""the earth was shaking"""
67,"""that was the end for Germany"" He was in his 30's at this point in time. So, when he got on the front line that night, it was so cold he has his G.I. pants on underneath his regular workd clothes"
68,"It was so cold you could barely walk. He was an old can, they rolled in over they thought they could make a fire with some extra gas."
69,they kept warm that way. CONVERSATION CHANGES TO CLEVELAND
70,Moved to 105th in a Jewish Neighborhood (Glenville area)
71,The Jewish families started moving away little by little. 55th street was where a lot of things were happening.
72,moved to 130th (address 895?) they had issues with the schooling there.
73,"Therer was a school right by their house, but their son couldnt go there. The kids were getting two recesses, the school was too crowded"
74,"They had two recesses, one for the white kids and one for the black kids. the families got together to protest for the way they were treating kids at George Grant."
75,"They had planned to march, but saw some guys getting drunk before the march so they removed themselves from the march."
76,"They moved to East Cleveland in 1962, and then had a G.I. house. 12606 Arlington was one of their homes."
77,"""Everybody was poor""  .. he went back into the dry cleaning business."
78,He was getting about 55 dollars a week with a nickel raise every 30days. He worked two jobs
79,"He worked for National Acme though it was segregated, no black machine men were permitted."
80,"When he worked there, and wanted to work a better job than the sanitary jobs. The black co-workers didn't like him because he was literate, could read and write"
81,James wanted to be a machine man
82,"at Christmas, he recieved a bonus. There was one other guy that had the same seniority as he did."
83,"He had a labor Job , but finally was promoted to a Heat-treat position every once in a while."
84,The heat treat
85,They would harden all sorts of materials in the heat-treat. They hardended things by electric. He once got burt
86,All different sorts of classifications. He took over the 2nd shift at heat-treat.
87,"He was the only black person in his division. someone once said they'd wish he'd become the boss someday, but he never wanted to be."
88,"If you become the boss, you couldn't be a part of the union."
89,(pause) preps story
90,"discusses involvement with the Union. He denied the position to be a boss, and one of his co-workers ....-"
91,"told his boss, something that would get him in trouble. boss was just upset that nobody was on the same page"
92,"National Acme was down the street from Fisher Body, 131st and Coit ..something about pipe work place, a mattress place"
93,"right under the railroad tracks, a white motor company...everybody started to move away they..they also changed time of shifts to avoid traffic. Because nobody was living in cleveland."
94,"He lived off of 105th, he would hurry to work to get a good parking spot. the people who had a longer commute eventually caught on."
95,worked there from 1950-1977... it was a good place to work. There was a guard there
96,"There was a strict guy, one hot day he told them to get back to work and the head man said let us get air becuase it's hot out there."
97,"About 1970, he saw there was a lot of money in the bar business. He saw one guy who was in the business had two houses"
98,"So, they searched in East cleveland, found a bar there, but there weren't any black businesses over there. So they looked elsewhere but the other was too small."
99,"13825 St. Clair. ""El Patio""  they went to Beachwood for the registration: $125 a week plus on top of all other fees"
100,he worked the shift from 11:25 when he got off work 'til closing. But his business partner was not reliable.
101,the banks were moving out of the neighborhood
102,"So they went to Cleveland Trust, who told them that they had ""bad experiences"" with bars. so they would not give a loan."
103,"The person who owned the bar wanted him to buy it, but he wouldnt because he would have had to quit his job. He refused to quit his job"
104,"The people who registered the bar ended up offering a loan. But they didn't back up their loan. He had to get rid of the bar, though he owned a lot of the equipment in the bar."
105,A man who played cards upstairs ended up buying it.
106,the man who bought it wanted James to run it.
107,Recalls his many jobs
108,Changes subject to when he moved to 12606 Arlington and met George Forbes .. helped him run for councilman
109,A guy named Sweeney was up against him .
110,The politicians weren't making a lot of money
111,"Leslie asked his mom ""is it sunday?"" She said no why? ""because daddy's home"" Though he was on vacation..he realized he needed to stay home a bit more."
112,The kids weren't allowed to watch much tv except for their few programs. He took them all to the world fair in New York
113,"He couldnt get a room in New York, but eventually he found one but just for one night. When they got there they found another motel"
114,"Took dirt roads to get to New York, the highway wasnt there"
115,"He couldn't handle two jobs once eisenhower was president, the hours became longer, ten hours days"
116,105th and Colonial street
117,"when he lived on brant, there were 2 black families."
118,They didn't have a refrigerator back then. black people didn't live on the 1st or 2nd floor. They lived on the 3rd floor
119,"They finally bought a Frigidaire (refrigerator), and the landlord upped the rent because they had bought one. Then they bought a tv, and upped the rent again."
120,They lived on Pierpont Ave. he worked in the dry cleaners then.
121,"One night he heard Dick Goddards voice on the radio, said it was going to snow. Night before thanksgiving, and he woke up to a bunch of snow."
122,"The street cars weren't running, the snow was so deep. 9504 Pierpont. Businesses on 105th street: There was a Tijuana (club) Bellman Club"
123,"They would drive to 55th and cedar, a bar there."
124,"They opened up a private social club, they had charter for the club: The Ghana Social club: threw cabaret parties. Bring your own whiskey"
125,They had one store for produce: and they had to move the produce to the inside because people started stealing. Tom & Randy's store
126,Explanation of the Ghana Social Club (Les Explains)
127,the club donated money to the Forest Hill hospital. A lot of his friends were members.
128,"The club wanted to buy a bar, by what is now the cleveland clinic. But they wouldn't sell them a spot there."
129,***Shows the picture to Mark of the Ghana Social Club****
130,James explains that the guys who began the club all worked at the same place. Something about go-go dancers
131,the club saved a lot of money
132,they voted James out of the club because he didnt want to buy a bar.
133,"tapping noises** club broke up, but he can't quite remember. The club ran for at least 4 or 5 years."
134,talk about the picture
135,tapping of the microphone. discuss coming back to do a second interview
136,.... discuss second interview
137,James speaks up again about Rosa Parks and Martin Luther King
138,"He busted a tire once, and tires were rationed"
139,They intentionally got black coal miners drunk on sunday nights so that they would get fired .. ?? Story is a bit confusing here
140,Heard someone use the N word
141,"He hit the guy who made the comment, they were on a bus"
142,His wife hit the lady on the head. They thought it was his daughter b/c they were ten years apart.
143,Their oldest son was married at 16. Then went into the service
144,He is proud of his children ... they went to check out school and they sold beer at cleveland state they thought that was unusual.
145,...
,second recording
0,Talks about Matewan Virginia. He did not want to discourage a celebration by talking about the bad things that happened in Matewan
1,Les explains the different articles about a celebration in Matewan. Someone wrote a very long story just about him.
2,Talks about the articles.
,third recording
0,"Gainesville Texas, he decided to ride the bus back to be with his wife. Someone on the bus said ""Hey Soldier move to the back of the bus"""
1,He had never been told to get in the back of the bus before.
2,He told the man that the other people could get into the back of the bus.
3,"Some white soldier said ""Aint this soldier in the army like we are? Can't this soldier ride the bus like we are?"""
4,"In Cleveland, when he recieved the deed for his house : the house mentioned something about ""No Negros"" to be permitted in that neighborhood"
5,"He had to find a G.I. bill, he had to find somebody to help him buy the house."
6,"Mentions ""income property"""
7,"They sold it to him, with the language still written in the deed. They did have issues with the school...Had a pimp neighbor?"
8,"mentions politics, Carl Stokes, Leo Jackson"
9,ends again by talking about his kids
10,