Abstract
Jimmie Waugh discusses moving from Mississippi to the Mount Pleasant neighborhood in Cleveland, Ohio around 1959. He talks about attending Alexander Hamilton Middle School and John Adams High School before joining United States Military in 1965. He then tracks his professional pathway after leaving the military: he worked for the Warrensville Fire Department and then began doing maintenance work for the Thea Bowman Center when it still a part of Epiphany Catholic Church. He talks about the evolution of his work at the Thea Bowman Center, the network of churches in the Mount Pleasant neighborhood, and the community surrounding the Thea Bowman Center.
Interviewee
Waugh, Jimmie (interviewee)
Interviewer
Carubia, Ava (interviewer)
Project
Union-Miles
Date
1-15-2025
Document Type
Oral History
Duration
36 minutes
Recommended Citation
"Jimmie Waugh interview, 15 January 2025" (2025). Cleveland Regional Oral History Collection. Interview 483008.
https://engagedscholarship.csuohio.edu/crohc000/1354
Transcript
Ava Carubia [00:00:00] Okay, hold on. And I’m gonna say my little introduction because we have to put that at the beginning of each interview. So when people are listening, they know what it is. But today is January 15th, 2025. My name is Ava Carubia and I’m here at the Thea Bowman center in Cleveland, Ohio. Interviewing Mr. Jimmy Waugh for the Cleveland Regional Oral History Project. Thank you for agreeing to be interviewed today.
Jimmie Waugh [00:00:27] You’re welcome.
Ava Carubia [00:00:28] And for the record, can you please state your name, your birth date and where you were born?
Jimmie Waugh [00:00:35] The date for my own birthday? […] 1947.
Ava Carubia [00:00:44] And your name is?
Jimmie Waugh [00:00:46] Jimmy Waugh.
Ava Carubia [00:00:48] And where were you born?
Jimmie Waugh [00:00:50] Yazoo City, Mississippi.
Ava Carubia [00:00:53] All right, so can you talk a little bit about how you got from Mississippi to Cleveland?
Jimmie Waugh [00:00:58] My family chose to migrate to Cleveland in relation to my father’s side of the family and connected with people in that early years of employment here. And I was at Neighborhood at 133rd and Union Avenue. So by his preference, their preference to connect to Epiphany Church, this site. And I went to church here as a member, including a sister and some others that connected to some of the other Catholic churches because they prefer to get service through the Catholic Church system.
Ava Carubia [00:01:57] So what year did you move to Cleveland?
Jimmie Waugh [00:02:01] It was around nineteen six, nineteen fifty nine. Sixty era.
Ava Carubia [00:02:09] And how old were you?
Jimmie Waugh [00:02:11] I was the eighth grade at this church.
Ava Carubia [00:02:17] So that’s when you started coming to this church?
Jimmie Waugh [00:02:22] And after that. After I left this church, I entered the public schools. My sisters went to the Catholic schools. They were taking better care. Right? So I was at the neighborhood junior high. Up the street here was Alexander Hamilton. Before it closed, it was up the street further. And I went to high school at John Adams High School. So I went to the military. 1965. Yeah. So that’s where I started. So when I came out of the military, I still lived in this area. Fortunate for me, I got hired in the Warrensville Fire Department and started working for them. But in terms of my nature training, so to speak, even then, in service of the community, I was just a good parishioner, I guess you could say. And some of those pictures I was telling you about were people that in that nature was to serve the community. And we always had good relations with people in the neighborhood who liked to serve the community. Those pictures you were laughing about that are old like me, were in service of the different areas of community, groceries and all of that stuff. And Mr. Bill Davis established the food pantry and established probably one of the first ones in the area.
Ava Carubia [00:04:38] When was that, do you think?
Jimmie Waugh [00:04:39] It was the early 90s or before even. Yeah. So they established themselves to be of service to the community in that sense, you know, especially partnering off with food service and all of that other stuff, if there were other services to pay for different things. He had worked for the GI Bill and all that stuff. So he knew how to connect with people and he just was a great service servant, those things like that.
Ava Carubia [00:05:30] What was his name again?
Jimmie Waugh [00:05:32] Bill Davis. Mr. William Davis.
Ava Carubia [00:05:38] I want to go back a little bit and then we can talk more about the Bowman Center. But can you tell me what your experiences were like in the public schools in Cleveland? Like at Hamilton and John Adams?
Jimmie Waugh [00:05:56] It was mainline, you know, trying to. I would say at the time I was pretty comfortable, so to speak, with public schools, integration and all of that at that particular point. It seemed to be okay at the time. So that’s where I got pretty fairly comfortable with the public school system, so to speak. And when I graduated from high school and had to make a choice, since I didn’t have resources to be scholarly, followed monetary, I knew that I had to join the military, which happened in ’90? Well, later, you know, when I got out of the military, I looked for employment and fortunately had been in the fire department, and I ended up with the fire department in the City of Warrensville Heights.
Ava Carubia [00:07:19] What year did you come back from the military? (Laughs) I’m asking you lots of hard questions.
Jimmie Waugh [00:07:30] Well, this shouldn’t be that hard. Like I said, I just came from the hospital and everything doesn’t snap to me right away. In 60, 70, around the late early 70s that I came out into. Out of the military. Is that what I was saying?
Ava Carubia [00:07:58] Yeah. And then you joined the fire department in Warrensville?
Jimmie Waugh [00:08:01] Yeah, and I got hired, partly on the basis because of my experience and understanding of being in the fire department. And therefore that’s when I established employment in the city of Warrensville Heights and worked for them. So in relation to all of that was with that good employment system, you know how firemen are. You know, we had time off, so to speak. Then as a parishioner and with where my father and mother are, I helped them establish whatever they wanted to do in the neighborhood, so to speak. But mainly me, with the time I had, the background and the ability to my paint or do little jobs and everything in that city. The parishioner, Father Dan Behen, you might mention his name.
Jimmie Waugh [00:09:19] Yes.
Ava Carubia [00:09:21] How do you spell his last name?
Jimmie Waugh [00:09:24] Beg your pardon?
Ava Carubia [00:09:25] How do you spell his last name?
Jimmie Waugh [00:09:26] William, Bill Carg.
Ava Carubia [00:09:29] Okay.
Jimmie Waugh [00:09:29] He was the first. Well, there’s a Bill Carg also with it their impel,their style of ministry would always help to know that they want us to help whatever was going on in the neighborhood, so to speak. And it’s always like people, you see the photos out there, people that had the same type of motivation to serve others, so to speak. Yeah, wish I could put all my photos up for you, but you saw what they were.
Ava Carubia [00:10:12] So can you talk more about how you started working here?
Jimmie Waugh [00:10:23] The natural way of serving. I would end up offering my services, so to speak, with the time I had off and so fortunate to have a decent job, so to speak. So that was very natural for me. So whatever abilities I had, painting and. Or anything of that nature to serve the community, that’s what I would always do. Now, naturally it became bigger than that because the guy that was ahead of me, older than I was, became the maintenance man. I think he passed away or he got sick. So I said, if you want me to, I can just go and become the maintenance man so I could get a little pay on the side.
Ava Carubia [00:11:28] And when was that?
Jimmie Waugh [00:11:30] When did I first become of service?
Ava Carubia [00:11:34] Well, when did you first, I guess when did you start getting paid to work here?
Jimmie Waugh [00:11:39] When we still would serve as a church before they’d start closing other churches up and I mean. They had names and dates and different things that I would have to put that back down and recall. But that’s when I became also the maintenance man. Was the point that the person that I took over as the serviceman, which was in the. In the 90s, early 90s, maybe.
Ava Carubia [00:12:22] You said something that I want to ask you more about. You said that something about your parents, how you wanted to help them because they had certain obligations in the community. What. Is that what you said? What did you mean by that?
Jimmie Waugh [00:12:35] Oh, only. Only in a natural way, the way that I should help them out, you know, serve. Because I was. I had a decent job and could in my spare time, help with things that needed to be done.
Ava Carubia [00:13:01] So your parents were parishioners of this church?
Jimmie Waugh [00:13:04] Epiphany.
Ava Carubia [00:13:05] Okay, of Epiphany.
Jimmie Waugh [00:13:07] My father had later got a job at community college in service, more or less a similar service in the maintenance department. So he was fortunate in that sense. The last job that he was able to get.
Ava Carubia [00:13:28] So when you started working here in the 90s, can you describe what it was like to be the maintenance man here?
Jimmie Waugh [00:13:46] It gave me an opportunity to be of service, which I was. I enjoy. I don’t know if I so much enjoy it so much, but I did find it as an opportunity and being able to serve and to work as a maintenance man, so to speak. And that included whatever it was called for at that time, way back then even. I might have even cut grass and other stuff too. But whatever my role was needed to serve, I was pretty comfortable with that. I felt it was an ideal service job. And the fact that I could get a little pay, also that I could serve my community.
Ava Carubia [00:15:01] And what kind of programs were there here at that time when you first started working as a maintenance man?
Jimmie Waugh [00:15:14] In terms of what was needed? Mr. Bill Davis, who was making sure that he could set the program up with the food services, food bank or whatever. I could load and unload whatever might have been needed for that area. There’s so much evolved here. There’s that one room in there that they had redid. Used to be, actually was the food pantry, but that was all taken apart and redone because they wanted to move it. This is later on, putting that other pantry that you see in the back. Put in the back later on. But there was. I mean, there’s been such an evolution of different things that have been changed that needed to be done. Plumbing that was also coordinating. I’m not a plumber, but I had to call on the right people to do different type of services. Electrical, plumbing and all of that kind of stuff. Everything had to be, in a sense, had to be coordinated to keep everything going. And I had to call on the right people. Not that I’m an expert, but I could choose different people to call and have them do different things and to have them being paid out of our budget. Whoever was our pastor or the later one, Father Dan, they were the people that I called over on while it was still a parish.
Ava Carubia [00:17:21] When did it officially stop being a parish?
Jimmie Waugh [00:17:24] Oh, man. See, this is where you get me.
Ava Carubia [00:17:28] You don’t have to say an exact date, but, like, what, around time period?
Jimmie Waugh [00:17:47] Middle 90s, we had a bishop that decided that we needed to close some of these parishes up. We weren’t having enough people and money, so to speak. And he wasn’t so into us being low service people, doing our own service, so to speak. So in the 90s, I’d say that things kind of declined in terms of willingness to keep us as we were, so to speak. I think my memory is just shut.
Ava Carubia [00:18:43] That’s okay. You remember a lot. Another question I have, is you’ve talked some about Mr. Bill Davis and Father Dan. Who were the other people that were involved?
Jimmie Waugh [00:18:58] Okay. I should have mentioned Mary James, she’s a minister. She was uniquely designated and allowed to be the administrator of the parish in the early 90s for about five years. Now, her husband, more or less they lived here in this building, but they still had a house out here. Her name is Mary Jane. She still lives at the parish that I live now. Holy Spirit. She was very important and a great administrator to, early 90s I believe for about five years she was in service of the place also. And a nun, Sister Sheila. Sister Sheila Marie Toby was a, was a nun that was the administrator here in her later years before the parish was forced to close out. Now there’s a whole other revolution or revelation about people that took over that we didn’t necessarily agree with too much. You don’t have names, do you in your head.
Ava Carubia [00:20:50] Well, if you want to talk about the years after the parish closed, could you talk some about that? What changed here?
Jimmie Waugh [00:21:01] There was a degree of people that wanted things to more or less take over. So they force the way that they want things to be and more and less terms of how we relate the church community that was awful related to us. But that’s just a whole nother story. Yeah.
Ava Carubia [00:21:42] Well, one thing I’m wondering is you’ve been in this area for a long time. How would you say it’s changed over the years?
Jimmie Waugh [00:21:56] How it changed? I’d say the good thing is that in terms of service there was a drawing away the services that we wanted with the food. We also really wanted the parishes that we had already related to stayed connected with us and donated every kind of way that was possible and still is. A lot of money donated and services in that whole church. Electrical work had done with money that was donated from the parish. What’s the name of that parish? St. Dominic’s that particular pastor had the way over a lot of donations. There’s another one, there’s others that were determined to make things able to be done for food service and things to cook, so to speak. All that kind of stuff was made possible. The dedication of the churches remained, I mean and still are.
Ava Carubia [00:23:42] What churches are you talking about in particular? You said St. Dominic’s?
Jimmie Waugh [00:23:47] St. Dominic’s. St. Rita. St Rita’s is one of its called. There was even since I was talking about that one nun that ran things at some point she was connected with the name of the school? Saint. What’s the name of that school? Do you know? You didn’t go there, do you? It was. She was. She would get people to donate little services and everything. They would like do a whole painting wall, all that kind of stuff. [Unclear] and other connected schools, so to speak. There’s so much. There’s so much different things that came at me, yeah.
Ava Carubia [00:25:04] So would you say that the churches in this area, there’s a strong network of them?
Jimmie Waugh [00:25:12] Yes, absolutely. And still really are. And also they developed out of that guys that were professional background with electricity and different services. You might have seen the garage out there where we kept clothes and everything. We evolutioned. What became of that because we kind of abandoned it. And that wasn’t the leadership that services now that agree with what we wanted to keep servicing. And so a lot of it was membership from churches that just donated stuff, you know. Then we had a row of garages. There was a point, there was a commitment which they told me what we want to be in a dumpster and we want to clean it out and let’s make space for keeping donations to give people different things. Clothes and so clothes and shoes and so forth. That has continued and that continued on even now that Mary, that there were people before her, [unclear] looking for the desire to let’s keep things and give away what people need. Anyway, so we continued that program for the last several years.
Ava Carubia [00:27:28] I have another question. It’s just at the top of my head and then I might have forgotten it. Oh, what’s one of your most positive memories that you’ve had while working here?
Jimmie Waugh [00:27:51] Positive memory? Memory or memories?
Ava Carubia [00:27:55] Yeah.
Jimmie Waugh [00:27:59] I have always felt like committed by parishioners, church members, believing that this place would be a great service, should be of service to the people on all levels. Now, I talked about that pastor and things that he had made for, but because the pastor at St. Dominic’s I mean, he is the most fortunate in terms of service, able to manifest. Manifest. Manifest. I almost said the right word. Money to make it. Make us able to build and do a lot of services, electrical, plumbing and all of that. I mean. Hey, over there. Hello [recording pauses as someone walks into the room]
Ava Carubia [00:29:03] So you’re talking about. I think you were talking about Bill Davis or you were talking about someone before.
Jimmie Waugh [00:29:11] Bill Davis and Mary James, Sister Sheila, who would work for, who had also been the administrator here before the church closed. And then leadership kind of changed. Basically it called on people to serve themselves, more or less.
Ava Carubia [00:29:53] Well, I really just have like one more question and then there’s gonna be time for you to add on anything that we didn’t touch on. But since this is an oral history interview, what message would you like to leave for future generations?
Jimmie Waugh [00:30:24] Only story that I have lived by in this area was. Serve each other and serve and see as self. As we always kind of saw ourselves as a church, so to speak. (Looks out window) It’s a big squirrel. That we saw ourselves as serving ourselves as a community. And those churches also very willing to serve us also. And glad to be of service. Glad to be of service. So we enjoyed the community. Community, you know. That’s it. Serving community. I see it that way. Even though there are those who are distinguished and willing to give and do more based on the gifts they have been given.
Ava Carubia [00:31:43] Well, thank you. Is there anything else you’d like to add that we didn’t talk about?
Jimmie Waugh [00:31:58] The willingness to receive and give to each other for the service of the community and continue it on that basis. Now a lot of get lost in social services type of identity. Even now, we have a little bit trouble with where the develop, became developed careers out of social services. But in terms of service, the spirit community was of a church nature. And the community is. Yeah. And we give nicknames even now to people. Reverend this or Reverend that. People jokingly, but yet it’s truth. “How you doing, Pastor What’s-Her-Name?” (laughs). And Reverend so and so. And people will walk in and say, stop that cursing inside the church. And then those who with their little devil hats on, this is not a church, let us know, oh, this is not a church.
Jimmie Waugh [00:33:41] We’re better off if we’re telling it, looking at it that way. You know, there’s a whole side of this. Did you talk to Sylvia at all? On the other side of this, the churches also were in favor of us having programs for young kids with music and arts and so forth, which we developed at some level, which kind of got squashed that we didn’t like. And at this point, that’s a dimension of me that I would like to see us work on. That there’s something always being developed for kids to be singing and dancing and learning music. A music instructor type person. Mainly she starts with violins and things like that. And they all have kids together and would rather, and look for us to have putting together musical children doing all kinds of play programs, so to speak. That’s a dimension that I would like to see happen as I’m getting older. I wish that would be more of that. We have some degree in the summertime. If you ever get to talk to Sylvia, she would tell you about that. But some of that in the summertime, there’s just so much I wish for.
Jimmie Waugh [00:35:46] I don’t know anything else I can forget or forgive, remember.
Ava Carubia [00:35:52] Is there anything else you want to add?
Jimmie Waugh [00:36:01] Not off-hand, right now.
Ava Carubia [00:36:03] Okay, well, I’m going to end this recording.
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