Mike Tucker Interview, 23 October 2025

Abstract

In this 2025 interview, lifelong East Cleveland resident Mike Tucker reflects on his upbringing, education, and experiences. He discusses his years in East Cleveland schools, his time at College, and his varied career as a school resource officer, cook, and entrepreneur. Tucker describes the origins of his flooring business and the influence of his father, a long-standing East Cleveland business owner and community figure. He also details his involvement in the Shaw Reunion Association, including its scholarship work and community role. Throughout the interview, Tucker offers informed commentary on the evolution of East Cleveland, drawing on his extensive knowledge of local businesses, institutions, and neighborhood change.

Interviewee

Tucker, Mike (interviewee)

Interviewer

Mays, Nick (interviewer)

Project

East Cleveland

Date

10-23-2025

Document Type

Oral History

Duration

90 minutes

Recommended Citation

"Mike Tucker Interview, 23 October 2025" (2025). Cleveland Regional Oral History Collection. Interview 757011.
https://engagedscholarship.csuohio.edu/crohc000/1415

Related Resources

East Cleveland @ Cleveland Voices

Transcript

Nick Mays [00:00:00] My name is Dr. Nicholas Mays and today is October 23rd, 2025. We’re here in East Cleveland for the East Cleveland Oral History project joined by Mr. Mike Tucker, a a lifelong East Clevelander, Shaw alum, entrepreneur and a community leader. Mr. Tucker’s family has been a part of the the city’s business. He and his family has been a part of the city’s business and cultural fabric for over 50 years. From his work and as a business owner and as a school resource officer to his long service with the, with the Shaw Reunion association. His story, this story captures East Cleveland’s evolution through the eyes of someone who, who’s lived it, served it and helped sustain, sustain its spirit. Mr. Tucker, welcome and thank you for being with us.

Mike Tucker [00:01:03] Thank you.

Nick Mays [00:01:04] Let’s start by giving us your, your full name, your age and date of birth.

Mike Tucker [00:01:11] Michael Tucker, I’m 59 years old. Date of birth is […], 1966.

Nick Mays [00:01:17] Thank you. So we’re going to first start with our first topic, family and East Cleveland roots. Let’s start with your family story. You were born in, in Cleveland but, but, but raised in, in East Cleveland from an infancy. So since you were an infant.

Mike Tucker [00:01:41] I might have stayed, I might have had a Cleveland residency probably weeks or maybe a month. So it wasn’t, you know, it’s just by, by nature I was born and my parents were living on Seawall at the time, but I don’t think we stayed there that long. So I don’t know anything about that part of, you know, that’s the Glenville area and I tell them all the time, I could have been, I could have been a Tarblooders but blessed to be a Cardinal. So you know, I was born and actually I was born and raised in East Cleveland.

Nick Mays [00:02:15] What do you remember about growing up in East Cleveland and you know, I mean, you know, elementary, junior high.

Mike Tucker [00:02:24] Well, East Cleveland was a very family orientated city, big with community engagement. We had a lot of things to do growing up. Little league baseball. We had our own swimming pools, tennis courts, ice skating rinks. You name it. It was here.

Nick Mays [00:02:46] What kind of child were you or kid were you?

Mike Tucker [00:02:50] I was bad, I was bad growing up, man.

Nick Mays [00:02:55] What did you do for fun?

Mike Tucker [00:02:59] I played, you know, Little league baseball, did a lot of playing football in the street, you know, growing up with my friends and Cub scouts and we did, you know, you name it. You know, back then all activities were outside because you know, we didn’t have the modern day things they have today like the PlayStations and computers. We didn’t have that. So all our fun was creative fun. So it was a lot of outside for me.

Nick Mays [00:03:31] Where was the hangout area for you and your friends?

Mike Tucker [00:03:35] Alder Avenue, my street, My friends, East Cleveland is a tight knit community, but you were bound to your street a lot. So my street was Alder Avenue. All my friends I grew up with like brothers. So we all played on the street. It’s all day thing from baseball to football to some type of track hide and go. I mean we just created everything and just did everything on the street.

Nick Mays [00:04:03] What street did you grow up on?

Mike Tucker [00:04:05] Alder Avenue.

Nick Mays [00:04:06] Okay. Is that what it’s considered? Up the hill or down the hill?

Mike Tucker [00:04:10] No, we’re down. I’m down the hill. I’m a down the hill, East Cleveland guy.

Nick Mays [00:04:15] What does that, what does that mean to you? And I’ve been asking other individuals like, what does that mean to you personally? Like up the hill and down there? Because you seem like passionate, like. Oh no, I’m from down the hill.

Mike Tucker [00:04:28] Yeah, yeah, it’s, it’s. We’re rooted down here, to be honest. So when you, when you think of East Cleveland, in my opinion up the hill, you’re bordering Cleveland Heights. So we didn’t border anything. We were true East Cleveland with an epicenter of, of it all of the city. So. Well, I got friends that were. They grew up the hill in these Cleveland that part. But always tease them like East Cleveland Heights, you know, not East Cleveland.

Nick Mays [00:04:58] You do you, do you think it’s a identity thing, like people residents of East Cleveland identify with, like downhill or up the hill.

Mike Tucker [00:05:09] I mean it’s not, not really. It’s just a, a joke among some, you know, your friends. Where did you live and who you grew up with?

Nick Mays [00:05:19] Because everyone still goes to the same [school], right?

Mike Tucker [00:05:21] Absolutely. So it’s funny because growing up I never knew that part existed because I never went that way. So I so me going on with the Chambers elementary school. So my area was Chambers. You have Prospect, you have Mayfair, maybe Rozelle. But East Cleveland, like I said, is sectioned. So if you live, if you went to Chambers, that little section over there, you just knew everybody in that section. You went to Rozelle, that’s like superior area. So you knew everybody over there and you really didn’t get to the chance to meet other people of your age until you went to Kirk. That’s when you went to Kirk. Then you met everybody. So you know, by being only one high school and one junior high school and several elementary schools. So by the time you get into seventh grade, you just meet everybody. So you meet people from up the hill, you meet people Superior Avenue that way, you meet some people down Euclid that way. So you just meet everybody.

Nick Mays [00:06:30] Your father was a major figure in East Cleveland’s business community, owning a series of establishments. What was it like growing up in that environment?

Mike Tucker [00:06:43] A lot of people looked at it as me being privileged or some people might say well off. I didn’t. By me being as humble as I am, I didn’t look at it that way because I thought that everybody had that because, you know, my friends, we all played together. It wasn’t disparity and none of that, but I just didn’t see no difference.

Nick Mays [00:07:08] How was your daily life or your, your experience different? Because your, your parent, your family’s entrepreneurs; they own businesses. So does that mean that after school you come and wash dishes.

Mike Tucker [00:07:23] I get it. Well, after school I worked over the summer. Like when I got to the age of like maybe 13 or 14, that’s when I ended up starting really working for my father, his businesses. And I worked in the store over the summer. And so it was pretty mainstream for me. Like I didn’t really have, you know, the privilege. It wasn’t like that. I didn’t live a privileged life like people thought I did. It wasn’t, it wasn’t that.

Nick Mays [00:07:56] When do you think you became conscious that your father was a black owned business in a, in an American, in an America that, you know.

Mike Tucker [00:08:11] I think that really constrained because I didn’t really realize maybe until my original later 20s, because like I said, I thought I was normal. Like, okay, he owns a business. Like, no big deal, you know, so.

Nick Mays [00:08:28] Some people are factory workers, some people are engineers. My dad’s an owner.

Mike Tucker [00:08:32] I equated it to. He chose just to be his own boss. So I mean, what’s the big deal? That, I mean, that’s how I was looking at it. Because I didn’t, I didn’t, I didn’t need that as an image booster for who I was. So I didn’t use that as a introduction of who Mike was. That wasn’t me. Like, I didn’t have to introduce myself as, hey, I’m such and such. And my father, I never did. I still don’t do that. So that I didn’t, I don’t need that, this to make me as. That wasn’t the image for me. I Don’t. I didn’t need that for a booster or nothing. It was just, to me was normal. But other people from outside looking in, it’s like, you’re not living a normal life. Like, I’m like, why? Nothing different to me.

Nick Mays [00:09:19] So it was, it was in your twenties then that you really became conscious that your, your father, by being an entrepreneur and a business owner, is actually contributing to the, to the health or to, you know, to society, to the community. Because he’s hiring people, right? He has employees.

Mike Tucker [00:09:35] Yeah, it was in my twenties. When you start maturing, you start understanding a little bit more about life and this purpose. So that’s when I was like, okay, I guess it is a little, you know.

Nick Mays [00:09:53] Your dad was not only a business, a businessman, but a, you know, a community builder. He did some things in community, a mentor. Can you talk about that?

Mike Tucker [00:10:07] Well, I’ve always seen my father in the capacity of a boss. As far as, like, when I was younger, he was a manager, from what I’m hearing a manager at Sears; he was a manager for Lawsons. So he’s. It’s always. I’ve never seen him as a worker. I’ve always seen him as like some type of a boss or, or a, a person who’s in charge of something. So I, I never seen him as a worker. If he did work a job, it was before me. You know, I was really conscious of, you know, what he was doing as a young kid, but I never seen him work for anybody.

Nick Mays [00:10:54] Your father was on the board of trustees of the East Cleveland Public Library. What other kind of service did he do.

Nick Mays [00:11:08] Or just talk about that. His service for the East Cleveland Public Library

Mike Tucker [00:11:09] I vaguely know about. Well, I know he was on the board, but I vaguely. I don’t know exactly what he did on the board, what capacity he worked, but I know he was on that board. He was a manager for CMHA. I know, I know he opened a lot of those properties over there. I think King Kennedy might have been one of them. (inaudible). That was one of them.

Nick Mays [00:11:34] Introduce us to your parents. What’s your dad’s name? Your mom.

Mike Tucker [00:11:37] Dad’s name is Chester Tucker and my mother’s name is (inaudible) Tucker. You have brothers and sisters? Two stepsisters.

Nick Mays [00:11:48] How do you think your, your parents influenced your values and sense of connection to East Cleveland? Looking back.

Mike Tucker [00:12:01] Most definitely. It’s embedded in me, I guess, because I’m just. What I do is just natural. I don’t know. It had to come from Him. I mean, because I’m just. I just whatever capacity that I’m needed in, even with the [shaw] alumni association or being the class president of my class, I just got that quality where I can just take it. (Inaudible). So that’s definitely a learned, learned behavior.

Nick Mays [00:12:34] You’ve described yourself as a lifelong East Clevelander. What does that identity mean to you?

Mike Tucker [00:12:43] I’m proud of it. I mean, I love the city. I’m from here. It’s awesome to me because I have memories of how it used to be. You know. I can sit back and think about. I had great times. East Cleveland was very, very great place to live at that when I was growing up. It was everybody. It’s a place everybody wanted to come, move to.

Nick Mays [00:13:10] And despite the changes over the decades. You know, some decline and some other challenges that has plagued the city. Despite that, you you still seem resolved about your love and passion for East Cleveland. Where does that come from? What is that?

Mike Tucker [00:13:33] Love for my city? And I know, I know, I know what East Cleveland was; for some of these younger guys or people moving East Cleveland during that time of transformation, they probably have a remembrance of that. For them, that was good. But I remember when East Cleveland was just the top. Everything was beautiful, no vacant homes. It was flourish for businesses. I mean, I grew up in a time where East Cleveland was flourishing. There was a lot of opportunity for black families to come in here and make a living in East Cleveland. It was tight. It was times where people didn’t want to drive through East Cleveland because they were Bratenahl back then; if you’re familiar with Bratenahl, East Cleveland was just as strict as Bratenahl was. Like, you wouldn’t ride through East Cleveland. You know, like.

Nick Mays [00:14:31] Do you mean like law enforcement?

Mike Tucker [00:14:32] Law enforcement. It was strict. Like, you wouldn’t just ride through here. When I grew up, it was times where you leave your doors unlocked. I used to leave my bike outside all night long. The lights tamper with it. They picked the garbage. They had the service garbage departments coming. Get your trash out your backyard. They would show movies on the dump trucks in the back on the street for the kids. This was a lot going on. It was. Everything that you needed was right here. I didn’t have to leave to go nowhere. I had everything I wanted just right in the city.

Nick Mays [00:15:12] When do you think you became aware that you lived in a predominantly black [city].

Mike Tucker [00:15:19] When my white neighbors start moving. So I had white neighbors when I was growing up. I had a white neighbor.

Nick Mays [00:15:28] Speak to that.

Mike Tucker [00:15:31] Of course, as a young kid, I didn’t know anything about being any type of prejudice, you know, prejudices going on because my neighbors didn’t treat me that way, kind of nice. I mean, they would always give me candy. They were vary, you know, open speaking. I mean, I didn’t see that around, but I saw the change. The neighbors start moving, family started moving in. I. I want to say my parents might have been the second black family to move in.

Nick Mays [00:16:08] I’ve been grappling with it, with the question the entire time. Not the entire time, but when I became more intimate and engaging of residents, current and former residents, current residents like yourself about this. What I call. It shouldn’t be a phenomenon. I think the only reason it’s a phenomenon is, or I see it as a phenomenon is that it’s because of the city’s plight; that there are people who have the means and who’ve had the means to just simply move somewhere else but have stayed. What do you think that is? What is it for you?

Mike Tucker [00:17:03] Like I said, my mother still lives here, so. Going on 60 years in February, same home. People are just comfortable here. I mean, it’s. Some people just don’t like change. And some of the people are stuck it out and just say, I’m just going to stay here. It’s comfortable. It’s just. Change is inevitable. Like, every city is going through that transformation. Like Cleveland Heights is not what Cleveland Heights used to be. Shaker Heights isn’t the same. So it’s inevitable. It’s just transformation.

Nick Mays [00:17:44] I get a sense of, like, a love, an appreciation For the city, its history. And this is just from outside looking and kind of external.

Mike Tucker [00:17:58] So, yeah, I’ll probably. And it’s funny because through travels, and if I’m out of town, people say, well, where you from? You from Cleveland? No, I’m from East Cleveland. I’m like, no, I’m not from the East. Well, the city is Cleveland. I was like, I get it, but I’m from Cleveland. Like, this is where I’m from.

Nick Mays [00:18:25] I don’t think I asked you where your parents are originally from.

Mike Tucker [00:18:30] Father’s from Mason, Tennessee, and my mother’s from Macon, Georgia.

Nick Mays [00:18:35] Did they meet in the north or did they meet in the South?

Mike Tucker [00:18:38] I want to say they probably met in the North.

Nick Mays [00:18:40] Okay.

Mike Tucker [00:18:41] I want to say that I’m not 100 sure, but I’m Just say that.

Nick Mays [00:18:45] Were you able to meet like your family in the South?

Mike Tucker [00:18:48] Oh, absolutely, yeah.

Nick Mays [00:18:50] Did you guys ever go to the south, like when you were a kid?

Mike Tucker [00:18:53] Every summer. Family unions or. My grandparents were still down there. I still got family down there.

Nick Mays [00:19:02] So I want to pivot and talk about your education and maybe a little bit more about the youth experience. But I want to give you an opportunity to introduce your own family. Do you have a family?

Mike Tucker [00:19:17] Yeah, I have a wife. Her name is Carmesha Tucker. I got two sons. Five. She has three. So we’re blended family. She has three and I have Two. So all boys.

Nick Mays [00:19:34] Okay. I got a football.

Mike Tucker [00:19:37] She’s the only queen in the house. Her and my granddaughter. Three year old granddaughters, so. And I got a one year old grandson.

Nick Mays [00:19:46] So how old is your granddaughter and grandson.

Mike Tucker [00:19:48] Three, one. They run the house.

Nick Mays [00:19:50] Okay, Nice ages. Yeah. Okay, so let’s, let’s, let’s pivot. And so you attended East Cleveland schools.

Mike Tucker [00:20:04] All the way through Chambers Elementary School, Kirk Junior High and High school.

Nick Mays [00:20:11] You graduated. What year did you graduate Shaw?

Mike Tucker [00:20:13] 1984.

Nick Mays [00:20:17] What stands out about your experience as a student or athlete at Shaw High School?

Mike Tucker [00:20:23] Wow.

Nick Mays [00:20:24] Let’s unpack that. Let’s go there. Let’s talk about your experience at Shaw.

Mike Tucker [00:20:27] So I always say, if I could do it all over again, if I could just turn back the hands of time and just start high school, just all over again. So what’s great for me is the growth. So you’re going into school as a freshman. Maybe probably close to 3,000 students. So we would be classes.

[00:20:56] So here you are as a freshman going in schools, 3,000 people. You’re just not known. You’re just a regular student. For me to go from that to become one of the most popular persons to come out of the school is a huge thing because it was like I went from here to here, you know, it’s like my wife. She’s always just like, everybody knows you. Like as soon as I mention your name, like, oh yeah. Who don’t know him. So for me to go from just a average Joe to this guy here, that is as soon as you mention his name, like, I know that dude. Like, everybody knows me. It’s like, wow. Because I didn’t sit out to do that.

Nick Mays [00:21:46] So well, what happened in those four years? I get, I guess what happened between that?

Mike Tucker [00:21:52] I guess it’s character when you’re a. I guess a humble person. So it is crazy because when, when People know what you have because, you know, your family is successful and they think you’re well off. And I don’t show that. Like, I. I walk through life like it’s humble as I can be, because to be honest, I don’t own none of this. It’s not mine, so I don’t have a reason to walk with that type of chip on my shoulder anyway. But for them to just. You know, when I walk through the halls and then when I get to my senior year and I’m just this guy, and I’m like, what did it come from? Like, there’s nothing. So that. That my high school years are great. I had. I had fun, like, crazy fun in high school. Like, some great people. Teachers, teammates, coaches. I mean, I just had a ball.

Nick Mays [00:22:53] Expand on that. So you were an athlete. What did you [play].

Mike Tucker [00:22:56] Basketball. Okay.

Nick Mays [00:22:59] You got down?

Mike Tucker [00:23:00] Yeah, well, yeah, a little bit. We had great team, great team. I had a. I had a coach that was a. And I carry this with me now. He was very disciplined. I mean, he was a very disciplinarian type coach. That held you accountable. At the time, I didn’t like it. I don’t think none of our teammates, we didn’t like it at all because we didn’t really understand what he was preparing us for life for, you know, and it was. It was bigger than basketball. So, you know, as a kid, we just thinking, like, we playing ball. Why is this dude, this mean? Why is he. This. Why is it everything we do, we’re held accountable for, you know? And I’m like, I. And I used to say, like, this dude don’t like kids, man. He can’t like kids. The way that he’s, you know, has this. And it’s like, I look back and I’m like, man, this is exactly what we needed. So I look at how I was coached and how my coach was and the things that he was able to do, and I look at these kids now, it’s night and day. Like, these athletes now, they’re not disciplined. They’re not held accountable. These coaches are their friends. So he was more of a father figure than a coach. I didn’t agree with some of the things that he. His coaching style, but now I understand why he was the way he was.

Nick Mays [00:24:25] Was basketball the only sport you played?

Mike Tucker [00:24:27] Well, I played football, like, at Kirk. You know what the Shaws like. I don’t know. We weren’t that good. I’m not playing no football.

Nick Mays [00:24:34] Is there any other extracurricular that you were a part of.

Mike Tucker [00:24:36] as far as all in high school, out of high school.

Nick Mays [00:24:40] In high school.

Mike Tucker that was it.

Nick Mays Can you. Can you talk about the structure? I hear a lot that they’re like, it was like a campus. It was like a college campus. You had different parts and.

Mike Tucker [00:25:01] Yeah, it was. So at shaw we had the vocational building, we had the academy building, and we had the tech. So it was three parts of the school. It was like a campus. Then we also had a courtyard. Then we also had a lounge. So it was. It was a mini hbcu. That’s what it was. And you think you go to school with close to 3,000 kids. That’s a lot. It’s a big school.

Nick Mays [00:25:34] What. Is there anything that, before we pivot away, is there anything that stands out to you? Anything particular that stands out to you in the four years you were at Shaw?

Mike Tucker [00:25:50] Just a bond that I had with my classmates. Like, my class is super, the class of 84. And I often tell people we’re the best class ever came through there. I’m like, there’s no. In all honesty, there’s no class like our class. There’s no bond like the bond that we have as classmates. And we have a lot of bosses in that class, a lot of guys and women that just went out and We become great entrepreneurs in that class. It’s like other classes know it. They. They always like, well, no, 80. No, it’s 84 or nothing.

Nick Mays [00:26:30] Were you guys represented at this year’s reunion?

Mike Tucker [00:26:34] Absolutely. Absolutely. We represent every year. We had the biggest tent, we have the most participation. Like no other classes. Like I’m telling you, there’s no class like ours.

Nick Mays [00:26:48] Do you think Shaw High prepared you for any of your experiences, whether you’re teachers, your own unique experience prepare you for adulthood?

Mike Tucker [00:27:02] Absolutely. So when I was in school at Shaw, we were also on the front of Ebony magazine as being one of, like one of the top high schools in the country. My teachers were very good, informative. One of my teachers, Mr. Hines, he was my sociology teacher. So he talked about this is. Now, mind you, this is 41 years ago. He spoke about the donut theory. So I asked him, I said, what is. What is the donut theory? He said, mike, I’m gonna tell you now. He said, if your family has any property in East Cleveland, tell them, don’t sell. So you talking to 18 year old kid, what I know about property or homes or anything like that? So I said, okay, so what are you getting at? I’m still not understanding what a donut Theory is, he said, well, here it is, he said, years down the line, he said it could be 20, 30 years from now. What you’re going to see happen is they’re going to allow people to move out in these suburbs of like Solon.

[00:28:18] I don’t even think Twinsburg was like, Twinsburg is now. But out in that area. He said were the higher taxes are. He said, they’re going to rebuild downtown and then those people who live out there are going to move back downtown in the lower tax bracket. He said, they’re going to rebuild all that. I’m like, okay, so we’re talking 41 years ago. Before it was Internets, before it was cell phones, before it was any of that. Today is happening. If you look, they build downtown up, everybody’s moving back downtown. Condos going up, new apartment buildings, they’re building a new stadium. So everything that he said is happening now. And I’m like, and when I see him, I always say, like, man, how did you know that? You know? But it’s happening.

Nick Mays [00:29:13] You later attended, after graduating Shaw, you later attended St. Augustine College and then Bowling Green State University. How did college life expand your worldview or influence your goals?

Mike Tucker [00:29:33] It gave me a lot of independence. You have to think 18 year old own going out of state to go to school. I’ve never been out of town. Like to actually stay and live. That gave me a sense of independency and to get me focused on which way I need to go in life. It was a lot of homesickness because, you know, I’ve never been away from home. Like I’m hearing them like, this is it, you know, like you can’t run home on the weekends. Yeah, you just here. So I think the worst decision I’ve made was to leave there. I should have stayed, but you know.

Nick Mays [00:30:14] Leave where?

Mike Tucker [00:30:15] Well, I mean, St. Augustine. I should have stayed. Looking back, I’m like, I should have stayed. But you know, being homesick, want to be closer to home. So that, that played a part in.

Nick Mays [00:30:28] St. Augustine’s at HBCU.

Mike Tucker [00:30:30] HBCU.

Nick Mays [00:30:32] Were you how, how conscious of you were you of the history of HBCUs.

Mike Tucker [00:30:39] I wasn’t at all? Honestly, I wasn’t. I just knew that all my friends were going to Kent, Akron or OU (Ohio University). And I was like, I don’t want to go to no school around here. I just want to get away from here. So actually the first college I really applied for was the Virginia Union, but they took so long to get back. I’m like, I gotta get to school. So I went with St. Augustine’s and I think they might have came to a college fair or something. We had. I said, I’m gonna go here. Never visited school, didn’t do any of that. So I just, you know, at the time was you simply fill it out, mailing it. Everything was done through the mail. So when I. I did that, it’s kind of a culture shock.

Nick Mays [00:31:29] What was your experience like at Bowling Green?

Mike Tucker [00:31:35] That was the first time that I really got a chance to deal with diverse interracial education. You know, I’m coming from an all black school, going to an all black college, and then I get to bowling green. This 50, 50 or maybe 60, 40. So that was the first time I really got a chance to really test my cultural conscience with that. Like, okay, because it’s funny, I had a Ebony magazine in my room and one of the roommates, he’s a white guy, he was from like, I’ve never in my life seen that. I’m like. I said, this is Ebony. I’ve never seen the Ebony magazine. What is that? So it was, you know, I was like, wow. But that was the first time that I really had a chance to, you know, go to a school that was interational mix like that.

Nick Mays [00:32:38] Were you ever a part of student groups or activities?

Mike Tucker [00:32:42] That’s the crazy thing. Even in. Even in high school, I didn’t do student council. I didn’t do none of that in college. I didn’t do. I wasn’t. I didn’t partake in any of that kind of stuff. Like anything that did with some type of leadership thing. I was like. I just. It didn’t. It didn’t interest me. So I. I think when I became into my own self and just evolved into who I am and now I’m here. I never in a million years thought I would be like a vice president of alumni association, president of my class reunion class, because I didn’t hold any of those type of seats in school. I didn’t do none of that stuff. I didn’t even go to homecoming dances. I didn’t do that. I mean, it’s just mind boggling that I’m here with this. Even here sitting, interviewing with you, because I didn’t do anything like that in school.

Nick Mays [00:33:33] Did you always plan to come back home after college or was your decision rooted in the sense of your connection with East Cleveland? Like, was there like any.

Mike Tucker [00:33:47] So I really didn’t. I was all over the place. I was at A point where a lot of young men are. They really don’t know what you want to do. Like, I was just. I was just playing it by ear, just taking. Whatever the road that lead me, I go there. If it led me here, I went there. So I. I didn’t have any balance. I was just. It’s all over the place until I. I think with this alumni association, it really got me in the line. It aligned me with who I am and what I should be doing.

Nick Mays [00:34:21] Your family’s businesses, from Columbo’s Room to Tucker’s Casino, Where are we right now? Where are we sitting? We’re in Columbus right now. Can you talk about what you perceive or believe to be the significance of your family’s business to the community?

Mike Tucker [00:34:49] We’re definitely a staple to the city, being probably one of the longest black venues or businesses in the city. If you live in East Cleveland, you know about these places. Either your, Your. It’s generational. Either your grandparents, your parents, now you got the kids and their kids coming. So It’s. You know, when you got a place that’s been around over 50 years, businesses, it’s just like McDonald’s, you know, like, you know, McDonald’s is on Euclid. It’s been there for 100 years. You know, these places been here for 50 years. Nothing’s. Nothing has changed much. It’s still here. It’s just a part of East Cleveland. When our other place of business burn. Burned down the Room Lounge, people were really, like, sad, like, man, this is a part of us. Like, we grew up with this. So when you got business where people have grown with or you’ve been employed by, you know, it’s just. It’s a great thing.

Nick Mays [00:35:59] You personally managed the Room Lounge for nearly 27 years. What did that experience teach you about leadership, people and community?

Mike Tucker [00:36:07] Well, that was it. That. That. That was the piece that I didn’t know at the time, but that piece plays a big part into what I’m doing now. The managing. How to deal with people, how to move people, how to. How to get people to understand things, how to be a. Just a good listener, other than, you know, to be a good boss, you also got to be a good listener. And to get people to want to buy into what you want them to do, you have to be a. A good listener, and you have to take ideas, you have to work with them. So like I said, I’m a people person. It’s. It’s this. Is this Is like. How can I put it? It’s like candy to a baby to me. When I have to deal with people, when I have to run these organizations or associations, it’s like second nature because I’ve done it. And I’ve always tell people, if you can manage a bar and bar maids, you can do anything. Like, you can manage anybody. And to be in this business, you have to be a people person. You have to be able to get along with people. You have to be able to, you know. You know, a bar is. Is like a. You deal with these places. You’re almost like a psychiatry psychiatrist because you listen to everybody’s problems. Everybody has a issue or something going on. So you got to listen to here.

Nick Mays [00:37:32] How has being a part of entrepreneurship kind of shape your perspective on the revitalization efforts that’s going on or even potential for. For more revitalization? And I say that because you have a unique lens, because you’re part of a family tradition of business, and you’re an entrepreneur yourself.

Mike Tucker [00:38:01] With the growth of.Getting the city back is a great thing, because I know where it was. So if you don’t have a vision of how something has been, you’re no use to the person who’s trying to regain vision. I sat with the Sandra Morgan who’s running for mayor now, and it’s a lot of things that we sit and we talk about. There’s a lot of things in the city that, you know, I let her know how it used to be and how things. Landmarks and so it’s a big part of the movement around here, you know; and I’m not just the only one. It’s a lot of people in East Cleveland who saw the same vision I saw; it’s a lot of them. And it went through the greatness and saw the transformation and still, you know, fighting to get it back to how it used to be.

Nick Mays Why?

Mike Tucker The love of the city. Why. I mean, it’s. This city is. Is so you got to understand this. The Rockefeller’s were here. So it’s rich, you know, it’s a lot of opportunity in the city of East Cleveland, and it’s a lot of room for growth and people who are really from East Cleveland want to see that. They want to see the city go back to how it used to be. You know, like I said, like, it was full of businesses, man. You had car dealerships on you. It was. It was flourishing, man. He’s Cleveland. We had a manners Bob, big boy down there. We had it just Was a whole lot of businesses in East Cleveland and it was. Everything you needed was right here. You get anything you need in East Cleveland. He was, it was. I remember when Hayden Avenue was straight and now it’s curved. I remember it was a straight street. I mean we had a movie theater Continental. We had everything we needed in East Cleveland. I mean we didn’t have to go anywhere, you know. And a lot, I think a lot of people are prideful of the city because they know what it was. like I can’t speak on. Like you have some people that come from like the Hough area and they’re very prideful about how the Hough riots were, how that transformation is. So they hold on to that history just like we hold on to the history of East Cleveland. Like I know how East Cleveland was. I mean this was probably the best city to live in. I know I was. I heard so many stories about how people were like, was trying to move here and how hard it was to live here, you know, to get, you know, residences here.

[00:40:39] But it was, it was ran, it was ran tight knit and it was a well put together city. And the crazy part was they didn’t even have a Mayor. City didn’t have a Mayor. [It] Was city manager at the time. So this city operated for years, was just a city manager. So I mean, I can’t, I saw the decline, but I just couldn’t. I don’t understand where it came from. You know, because at one point in time the city was flourishing. So for it to take this major decline, it didn’t happen overnight, but for it to see how it is now, it’s like (inaudible).

Nick Mays [00:41:27] What do you, what does that mean to you? A two part question. Like do you really mean. And do they really mean, like get it to back. Like to get it back to the, the time it was flourishing in the days or what it means is like get it robust flourishing, successful again. Because obviously we have evolved where you know, we’re 20, 25, you have technology is, you know, I don’t, I don’t think modernity.

Mike Tucker [00:41:58] I don’t think we could ever get it back to how it used to be. I don’t think. But I think that.

Nick Mays [00:42:06] So what do you mean by that then?

Mike Tucker [00:42:09] Let’s see.

Nick Mays [00:42:13] It’s not a trick. I’m just trying to get you to unpack that because I keep getting back to what it once was.

Mike Tucker [00:42:19] I don’t think we’ll ever, I don’t, I just don’t think we’ll ever get back to how the old East Cleveland was. Because times have changed. I think people are fighting just to get a place where they can come back and be comfortable. The city can at least look like it’s. It’s going in the direction. Like we might not live to see it, but at least we know it’s getting there. I never grew up with abandoned homes. Like, somebody always was living in the house, a home. I never witnessed that. Like, if you come in East Cleveland, you’ll go down the street and it’s like three or four houses in the whole street. I never. When I was growing up, every street was full. You know, this was a working community. Everybody worked. You know, parents went to work, you know, the kids, you know, it was. Now we’re closing schools now. Like, we. We have one high school and maybe. Let me see. Chambers is now closed.

[00:43:22] It was Chambers. Caledonia. Rozelle is no longer in existence. It’s tore down. You have Mayfair, Prospect, I think Caledonia, I think Mayfair, I wanna say Prospect is closed, Superior, I think that they wanna. I think they’re gonna take K through something, if I’m not mistaken. So it’s. I never, I’ve never. I didn’t grow up like that. Every school was full. Like, it’s just.

Nick Mays [00:43:50] How many schools do you have now? Like, do you have like one. How many Elementaries? How many junior highs?

Mike Tucker [00:43:56] I think we got one junior high, which is Kirk. We always had that. Got the one high school. Chambers is closed. I think it’s a multi community center. They turned into Rozselle. That school is torn down. So that’s no longer in existence. Yeah, Mayfair, I think, is still open. Caledonia is still open.

[00:44:19] Prospect, I think is closed because I think that’s where the board office is now in Superior. So I don’t. Not many.

Nick Mays [00:44:30] So I wanted to pivot here and talk about your personal career. Can you. Can you talk about the work you’ve done and the careers you’ve a part of after. After college, whether it’s culinary arts, resource officers.

Mike Tucker [00:44:56] I’ve Done a multitude of jobs.

Nick Mays [00:44:59] Talk about culinary arts and your passion.

Mike Tucker [00:45:02] Well, my passion is crazy because like I said, I learned cooking from just coming home. Trying to get this mic on here. That’ll work. Yeah. Like I said, I used to come home with some of my buddies and we would just barbecue. I didn’t know what I was doing. I mean, we could have got sick, like. But that’s where it started at. And then I just took a passion for like. Because you gotta understand, my father was running the bar, so his hours were late hours. And so my mother worked for Stouffer, which is Nestle now. Her hours was like 3 to 11. So I’m 12, 13 years old, by home, by myself, no doordash, none of that existed, you know what I’m saying? I couldn’t call and get. So I’ll find some refrigerator. Like, you know what? I’m gonna cook it. Sometimes my mother leave food for me to eat at home. Like, I don’t want that. So I’ll thaw something out and I’ll just try to cook it. So that’s where it started. And then it just, it grew from there. Then when I was of age to work out of the. My family business store, I learned how to do. They taught me how to cook corned beef. I was 14 years old, cutting corned beef, cooking it and roast beef. And so then it went from there to, you know, I was doing party trays and it just took off. So now I just. And I came up here, Columbo’s. Sometimes I come up here and cook when we have events on the Jackie side, we are catering, I cook for that. So it’s just a passion. It’s something I just do.

Nick Mays [00:46:49] I’m reminded of, and I don’t think I got it on the record. How many businesses did your, your, your family own?

Mike Tucker [00:46:59] So my father was. He had more businesses outside of the bar as well as this. So we had the room lounge was one, we had Tucker Casino, we had Columbo’s room, and then we had Tucker’s place, which is on Cedar Avenue. So we have four then. My father also had a leasing business when he was leasing cars. Olympic Leasing, he did that. He had a business where he was rehabbing homes and we did CMHA Properties. He did that. So he. All over the place, man.

Nick Mays [00:47:39] And, and. Okay, thank you for that. So I wanna, I wanna come back. What. Where did you work in the culinary or cooking?

Mike Tucker [00:47:49] I did Lincoln Electric. I worked for the Division of Youth Services, which is the detention center. I cooked there. So that, that cooking there, it really brought me full circle because you’re dealing with measurements, you’re dealing with certain ingredients. That really brought me full circle for me because like I said, when I was cooking up here in the bar, you cook everything on the menu.

[00:48:18] So it’s a lot of people who are cooks that work in those kitchens like that, it’s hard for them to transform and Work in a bar. Because if I work in Lincoln, I got a station. I might just have a fry station, or I might just have a saute station, or I might just do salads. That might be my job, just to do salads. Or I might just be a griller. You know, those places have certain places for you to do certain things. Whereas when you come in a bar or if you come into, like just say a wing place or somewhere, like a hot sauce or being. Being B M’s barbecue, you’re going to cook everything on the menu, but everything just like you guys want to order. Like, you might want a shrimp dinner, you might want wings. He might want to have a Alfredo. You got to cook all of that. You don’t have just a section. So it. That part brought me in with this part. So when I’m on this side cooking, I know the measurements, I know what I need to do. I know how much ingredients I need to do something with. I know how to, you know, have everything. But, yeah, it came full circle with those. I needed those two with this part. So it was easy for me to go from here to here. I’m like, this is easy. You just want me to do this? It’s no brainer.

Nick Mays [00:49:44] How long were you cooking as a career?

Mike Tucker [00:49:47] All my life. I mean, I still do it. I still do it. I never stop. I don’t think I ever will.

Nick Mays [00:49:56] Today you’re a school resource officer. How long have you been in this?

Mike Tucker [00:50:01] Nine years now.

Nick Mays [00:50:06] Tucks Fine or. Excuse me, Tucker’s Fine. What is it? Tucker? Tucker’s Fine Wood or Tuck?

Mike Tucker [00:50:12] Tucks Fine Wood, llc.

Mike Tucker [00:50:16]

Nick Mays [00:50:16] What inspired you to start a flooring company?

Mike Tucker [00:50:19] So I bought a home 2000. It’s a bungalow. So when I bought the home, those hardwood floors, I’m like, these floors need to be done over. So I called a company. You know, back then, these your phones? You couldn’t. Google wasn’t. There wasn’t any Google. So I looked up something called a company. They came out, they gave me an estimate. I’m like, there’s no way I’m paying that. That’s a lot of money. You know, back in the 2000, like, no. So I went to Home Depot in the section. I said, listen, I got hardwood floors in my home. I need to redo them. How do I do them? So the guy said, have you ever used a belt sander? I’m like, no. He said, well, I’m not gonna just X that. No, we’re not gonna let. I’m not gonna show you how to use a bell sander because you’re ruining your floors. You put grooves in it and you have to replace the whole floor. I said, I definitely don’t want to do that. So he told me to go rent a machine called an Orbiter. It’s like a giant. It’s a big square sander, but you can’t mess the floor up. It’s a longer process because you have to use a coarse piece of sandpaper. Then you go medium, then you go fine. So it’s like a three step process versus a bell sand. You just take it off with one and it’s done. So I learned I did it that way. He told me what to use, what, how many sheets of paper I might need. He asked me what color stain I wanted, the polyurethane. I said, I want a high gloss. So he showed me what to get. So I did my own home. So people will come in like, you did your floors. I did. No, you didn’t. I’m like, I did. I’m like, I did. Well, can you do mine right? Yeah. So I would just do the same process. And then I got better and better and better. Then people just start calling me, calling me and calling me. So I said maybe about five years ago, I said, I’m gonna make this because it was a hobby for me. You know, I didn’t set out for it to be like a, a paid.

Nick Mays [00:52:24] A paid hobby.

Mike Tucker [00:52:25] Yeah, it was just a hobby like that going around. Probably wasn’t pricing this jobs. Right. Like a lot of people was like, yeah, okay. That’s why it’s like this cheap. I don’t know, I was just doing it for hobby, you know what I’m saying? Like, yeah, I don’t know. Give me 200. I mean, like a whole room. They’re like, what? Okay, go ahead. So that inspired me. So I said, you know what? I’m gonna make this thing into an llc, making a company. And now this just took off.

Nick Mays [00:52:55] How, how long have you has Tuck Fine wood been an LLC or an official business?

Mike Tucker [00:53:01] Six years. Okay. So I’ve been doing it about 25 years. Six years. So it’s been. It was a hobby for all these years. And then I said, I better make this a see or something like, because I’m getting a little bit. A lot of work. So how.

Nick Mays [00:53:21] How many hours do you think you work a week on this business?

Mike Tucker [00:53:28] You really want to know? I mean, as far as just the or just in general. Yeah, like so. Because you Also you have a. A job, a full time job?

Mike Tucker [00:53:38] Yeah, I got a part time job. Crazy. So I’m here in the morning. I come here every morning in the bar. My alarm clock goes off. I have to be at work at 7, so my alarm clock goes off 5. I’m here no later than 5:30 in the morning. So I come here first stock. I get everything together for the day. Then I go to work every work at 7. I work that job. I get off work. It’s about 2:30, 3 o’. Clock. I work for Bedford part time from 4 to 8. So I work for the city of Bedford. I’m in the rec department. So I do that part time from four to eight. And that’s every day. So I’m in this bar seven days a week doing, doing that. And then I incorporate when I get jobs. I fit that in. So I’m busy all day long.

Nick Mays [00:54:31] I see. Would you have it any other way?

Mike Tucker [00:54:34] It was meant for me to do it this way. You know, it’s. You’re only. Certain people can only do certain things in life. I couldn’t do what you do because this is what you’re supposed to be doing to live my life. You probably be like, man, I cannot. Like, you literally couldn’t.

Nick Mays [00:54:55] I agree.

Mike Tucker [00:54:55] And a lot of people say, man, how do you do this? It was just meant for me to do this. This is what I’m meant to do. And then like it’s like clockwork. I get up and just do it. Like, it doesn’t get to the point where I’m like, I’m tired, I’m balled down. It’s just the makeup and everything that I’m doing is for a reason. I don’t know what, what the end result may be, but your work is a progress for something down the line. So for me, working this way, it’s a reason I’m doing this. It could be something that I need to understand here in life when I get here, you know, like, you really don’t know the purpose. I just, I just do God’s will and just flow with it. I take that path, the path that he led me to do. We all got a script. This is mine. Just like an athlete. Everybody can’t be an athlete. Everybody can’t do that. Everybody can’t be a singer. I tell people, when you look at, like, I’m gonna tell you people, the profession that really intrigues me, that I’m really like appalled by is actors. You have to be a special person to remember that in your head, a whole script. Think about it. You have to remember the Titanic. That’s a special concept. Even your work, a historian, like, you got to be special to do that. Like, you just can’t wake up and say, yeah, well, I’m gonna be a historian. No, you’re not. You’re gonna be a janitor. You know what I’m saying? Like, this is what you’re gonna do. So we all got our peaks and valleys. You just gotta figure it out.

Nick Mays [00:56:34] I want to pivot and to the Shaw Reunion association and some of your community leadership. You’ve been involved in the Charlotte union association since 2008. Now you’re serving as vice president. What drew you to support and be a part of that organization?

Mike Tucker [00:56:57] The togetherness I saw of, like, all these classes getting together. When Danny Barnes, when he brought this to me, and I don’t think I even told him this. So when he called me and said, look, I’m doing all the alumni function, and I might have a lot of my game. It was tearing down the old building, and I’m gonna do all alumni. So I’m like, first of all, I’ve never heard nothing like that. I’m like, all alumni. I’m like, okay. Like, all right, I’ll play in the game. So when I get off the phone, I’m like, man, this. We’re gonna do this. Like, I’ve never heard of no crap like this. So my expectations was maybe a few hundred people or maybe a packed gym. Like, when we was playing, I was playing. The gym was always packed. Maybe 200 people or maybe 100. Some people in the gym maybe healed. So when I went to playing this game and I saw it was standing room only and people standing around the floor like, man, what is this? And then after the game, they had the picnic. It was thousands of people. I said, this is special. I said, man, I want to be part of this. That’s how I got drawn to. Was electric. I’m like, I’ve never seen this many people.

Nick Mays [00:58:35] What’s the. Outside of the. The yearly weekend event? What’s the structure like? Do you. How many meetings do you. The monthly meetings? Quarterly.

Mike Tucker [00:58:48] We do monthly. We do take a break, I want to say around the Christmas time. So we take breaks for a minute, but we meet. We meet a lot.

Nick Mays [00:59:02] What’s actually going on? Not, obviously not the specific conversations you guys are having, but what’s in general, what’s going on at the meetings?

Mike Tucker [00:59:10] I missed this last meeting, but with the. The minutes right now, we’re gonna. We’re going. We’re going over the agenda. We’re just trying to. The budgets, what we lost, where we gained, where we can. What we can do to fix it, improve or improve it. Incorporate new things. So we just. Month. It’s basically just a monthly. In the budget. We’re just doing the whole budget of this reunion weekend and just trying to figure out for next year.

Nick Mays [00:59:50] When do you. When does the association start planning for the next. Next year’s event? After the current event.

Mike Tucker [01:00:02] We don’t stop. We just keep going. So, you know, we go to venues. We always, you know, trying to deal with the venues. It’s just an ongoing thing. It doesn’t stop. Just. We just.

Nick Mays [01:00:16] And you’ve been a part of this since 2008?

Mike Tucker [01:00:19] Yeah.

Nick Mays [01:00:22] Can you talk about the party with. No. You know what? Before we get that, I mean, obviously, you’re vice president of this association. What. And we talk about what inspires former current East Cleveland residents to come to this. This. What I. I’ve been. I’ve been trying to put my hand on, and I think I’ve been calling it like an Like an entity like this. This Shaw Class reunion, because it’s not like a regular. Like, oh, yeah, reunion. Like, it’s become like a. Like a holiday. It’s. It’s different.

Mike Tucker [01:01:07] Exactly what it is. You have people who plan their vacation around this time. I mean, around this reunion weekend, like, they actually plan a vacation to come up here and participate in activities around.

Nick Mays [01:01:21] I met. I met people from Idaho who. Who used to live in East Cleveland, and. And they said they come back every year.

Mike Tucker [01:01:32] So when you have an event, you can get thousands of people and there’s no trouble. Everybody is all love, it’s inviting. And I think the main thing for people that are on this committee is to give these kids the opportunity that we had going to school, you know, to try to give them the same opportunities we had to let them know that we do care.

[01:01:55] We do want you to do better, and we do want to provide better for you. So that’s my main reason, because I know these kids. They’re not getting what we had. They’re not experiencing what we experienced in school. I get it. Times have changed. A lot of the things that. The amenities that we had when I was going to Shaw, they no longer have, like, they don’t have a pool.

[01:02:19] We had our own pool. They don’t have that anymore. They don’t have the auto mechanics, and they’ll have the auto body. Don’t have a lot of the programs that we had offered to them. So my passion is a little different.

Nick Mays [01:02:35] What does it mean to the association as a organization that people come back every year?

Mike Tucker [01:02:42] Oh, we love it, man. This is what it’s about, getting people involved and getting people to understand that we still got love for the city, and this is what we do.

Nick Mays [01:02:55] That inspires you guys. The work that you do.

Mike Tucker [01:03:00] End result that people really are looking forward to. Something like that is. Yes. I mean, if you could put a product out and you know that people are going to just like, I can’t wait, you know, or I just. When we get here, man, this is the best weekend I’ve ever had. You know, I’m away from my job.

[01:03:23] I leave my wife at home because she don’t understand it. You know, she’s like, what is. This is a high school? You act like this is. You know, I get that a lot from people like, y’all like a cult, you know, like, you got people coming from everywhere and. And it’s Shaw this. The whole city is shut down, and it’s just nothing. But y’ all take over the whole city. And I’m like, yeah, you’re right. That is true. You know, you got other people from. You got people from Cleveland Heights and Glenville. They come to the park. I mean, they all. And they say the same thing. Like, man, I wish I could do. We could do nothing like this. So they hear somebody talk about, oh, bad East Cleveland, where it’s at the state. And for us to be able to do something that nobody else can do is fabulous to me. Like, this is the city. Y’ all look down and say, don’t go in East Cleveland.

[01:04:13] But nobody else can do. Nobody can duplicate what we do. No. No other class can do that. Heights, they tried it. No. Warrensville, they’re doing it now. They actually took a page that I. If you look at Warrensville, they set up just like we set up one high school, small community like East Cleveland, maybe four or five elementary schools, one junior high. So that demographically, they’re the same city. So they’re starting to do the same thing. And I see the progress. And I told the superintendent over there, Johnny, I’m like, this is how we started. Like, it’s gonna get bigger and bigger, and it’s getting. It’s growing, and it’s like they got a lot of community engagement. So I will say Warrensville is the closest to what to us now, but not in numbers. They still ain’t reached the numbers that we reached, but they’re, they’re, they’re there. I’ll give them a close second.

Nick Mays [01:05:13] I did attend this year. I was invited by a couple of people. I had a really good time. I was really inspired. I’ve never seen anything like that before. But I was moved and inspired by some of the things that I saw there. In my observation, one of them was, you know, intergenerational.

Mike Tucker [01:05:40] Yeah, right.

Nick Mays [01:05:42] Celebrating together and being together. You know, it’s like the grandma who graduated from Shaw. You know, the, the kids, you know, the kids. Kids, right. Like, it’s crazy. So, so the, the grandma graduated, the mom graduated from Shaw, and then now the kids in eighth grade. So I can’t go to Shaw next year. I can’t wait to go.

Mike Tucker [01:06:15] It’s weird because like you said, it’s. I went to school with some of the, the grandparents and then their kids graduated and then their kids, kids have graduated and then the kids got kids there. So it’s like this, the whole family is like.

Nick Mays [01:06:35] So it’s, it’s intergenerational. What I saw, I saw culture. I saw blackness. When I say culture. Like music?

Mike Tucker [01:06:45] Yeah, absolutely.

Nick Mays [01:06:46] You know, you know, entrepreneurship.

Mike Tucker [01:06:50] Yeah, definitely. That.

Nick Mays [01:06:51] Is this, is this something that I’m seeing through just my own kind of experience? It kind of, you know, through the, my lens as a historian, or is this something that you guys intentionally. As association, this is what you’re trying to do?

Mike Tucker [01:07:07] Well, once again, I can’t take away the vision of what Danny Barnes did. So this, I’m gonna just make this clear. This is, this was his baby. This is, was his vision for this to be the way it is. This is his thing. We just basically carried on from where he started. But this wouldn’t be possible if it wasn’t for him and his vision. This is. Wasn’t my vision. It wasn’t nobody’s vision that set on this board. I’m gonna say that because I know it to be his. And I think the powers to be was like, this was such a great event. Let’s not let this just be one, a one time thing. Let’s just pick up and keep it moving.

[01:08:00] But he, he set a fire through the whole city. Not just Shaw, but he did something that’s never been done before. I mean, this wouldn’t be this without him. We couldn’t. None of this would be possible if it wasn’t for his vision and his, his foresight, because I didn’t see it. And the first year that we had it, they actually Kicked us out of Euclid Creek.

[01:08:27] They said, no, no, no. It was so many people. They were like, nah, we cannot. No. So that’s when they moved it to Forest Hill. We got our own park. We go up there and. And we probably should have went there anyway, but you know, but by this thing being raw and he just, this was something he just did. He probably thought Bucha Creek was more feasible. But creek was like. And I remember because I parked like crazy miles away and I had to walk. And those dog on rangers was like, no, they blocked off the pathways. Like, I gotta get out of here, man. It’s a thousand people in here.

[01:09:10] I like, no. So that. That man had a vision, man, that I. I just didn’t see. I’m glad that he even called me to be a part of it because. Because you know, I was at home. Like, I wasn’t thinking about no basketball. Like I ain’t playing basketball in years. It’s like, man, I’m doing alumni game. All right, I started, I got on my treadmill. Soon as I got on the phone with him, I said, I don’t, I don’t, I don’t know. I don’t know about this.

Nick Mays [01:09:38] You started training.

Mike Tucker [01:09:39] I got on the treadmill, I promise you. I started getting on the treadmill and start running. I said, I got like three months. I said, I’m being some halfway decent shape. So that’s what I did. But I never thought what my wildest dreams that that would be this, you know. He planted his seed, man.

[01:09:59] He grew an oak tree like, like, dude, you just set fire, man. And he doesn’t get enough recognition for that. He’s a humble dude, man. You know, he don’t walk around tootin his horn like I did this or it was because of me. And no, you don’t get none of that from him.

Nick Mays [01:10:20] Well, well Put. But I want to give you a moment to talk about the party with purpose. I know that’s directly connected with the, with the grants that you give out or Scholarship. Scholarship. How, how important is it to give back? Using the Shaw Union as a platform to give back to future generations of students through your scholarship.

Mike Tucker [01:10:50] This alumni association. That’s what it’s all about. That is the most important part of that weekend. It’s that party with a purpose. That money helps some kid or some young ladies or young man for college. I mean, whether it be for books or some type of room on board or travel to get to where they need to go. Or anything. So that week, that Friday is probably the most important part of the weekend. And my job moving forward, which what I want to do is to make sure that all these other classes, classmates, alumni know that we really need you to come out here on Friday for that purpose so we can service the kids where they need to be serviced. So we did. The first time this year we did a stuff the bus. So we did. They filled half the bus with school supposed to supplies and stuff like that. So we’re just trying to do some things to help these students, help the school. Just trying to be innovative and creative to give back. So it’s all, it’s all for them. We don’t get paid for this. We don’t. You know, this is free work, but it’s work for the kids. And we’re just working for the community and city which we came from and serve. That’s it.

Nick Mays [01:12:25] So I want to pivot. Thank you for that. I want to pivot and, and talk about the transformation, which you were very knowledgeable and articulate about. You lived here your whole life and you, you said I saw the transformation. And I quoted that. How would you describe the changes you witness, like decade by decade?

[01:12:53] And I don’t know, you guess. Be specific when possible, but just in a more general way. Like describe the transformation, the 90s and the 2000s. Well, how do we get Here.

Mike Tucker [01:13:08] Hey. So the 80s from the 70s and 80s were just the best. When you get to the latter part of the 80s into the 90s, that’s when the drug epidemic came, which really crippled a lot of cities and it East Cleveland hard that the 90s transformation was probably the hardest part that hit me because I really saw a big decline and I just saw things that I wasn’t accustomed to seeing. You know, with the drug dealers, they’re hanging on the blocks, you name it. Like I’m like, where does this come from? Like you go from this to this. Wait a minute. So I saw the decline in the 90s, like the. Around 88, 89. That’s when I started seeing, you know, that was the big the drug epidemic hit. It was hitting a lot of black cities and it was crippling a lot of black cities. People started losing their homes through addiction. So that started, you know, you started having abandonment, people losing their businesses, people losing their jobs. So that helped with the decline of the city as well. Police department started going down. They became a lot of them during those 80s 90s. They became crooked because you pull these little doughboys, you Shake them down. You taking money from them, they became part of the problem as well. It helps help, you know, everything. It helped destroy the city, you know.

Nick Mays [01:15:03] So you got the 90s, then what’s, what’s, what’s happening in the 2000s?

Mike Tucker [01:15:11] Well, so you get into the 2000s, so that crack era started to fade out. But then you’re looking at the aftermath of the 90s that we’re dealing with in the suit that’s. We never recuperated from that. So we’re still dealing with the aftermath from that era. You still got the buildings, the homes that have just left there, they’re abandoned. A lot of businesses closing down in East Cleveland. So the whole economic scope change. There’s not a lot of the GE pulled out. You know, it’s not a. We don’t have any companies to bring in big tax revenues in the city. So they’re struggling that way. It’s just a lot. It’s going to be. I can see it coming back, I really do. But it’s going to take some work because you want to need these businesses that’s going to have a, some tax revenue and bring some tax dollars into the, to the city. You just can’t do it with homeowners because a lot of these homeowners are retired. You got a lot of people to rent. It’s just a whole structure just. It’s a rebuild process.

Nick Mays [01:16:29] What were the strongest years for East Cleveland in your memory?

Mike Tucker [01:16:33] The 70s and 80s. Definitely strong. I mean it was. City was booming, city was booming. I mean you had. GE was full. That whole spectrum over there was full. People was working, people had jobs. The city was flourishing in the 70s and 80s.

Nick Mays [01:17:02] We talked about transformation, we talked about businesses that had existed, opportunities, services that existed that. No, that no longer exists. You said you remember Civic center being built in and various business. Grocery stores, gas stations. Can you talk about that? Skating rings, restaurants.

Mike Tucker [01:17:29] And we had. On Hayden Avenue alone, I think we had, we had a Buy Right? We had a Bondi’s [Beverage and Deli] and I think that might have been A&P or Pick and Pay down there. We had three grocery stores on Hayden we had. It was a Pick and Pay on Euclid we had a, a black owned supermarket, Rogers Super Value. We had a bowling char lane, bowling alleys, we had movie theaters. Like I said, we had everything that you needed. You didn’t have to leave East Cleveland. We had a bank, right? On Hayden Avenue was a bank. We had a fish market on Hayden Avenue. Numerous barbershops, beauty salons, cleaners. I mean this city had everything. And to see where it is now, it’s like, like what happened. We don’t even have a grocery store in the city. We don’t have a bank in the city. We had a hospital here. Huron Hospital. That’s gone. So we had everything that we needed to service this community. It was here.

Nick Mays [01:18:49] How often did you go to the skating rink?

Mike Tucker [01:18:51] I went there every day. There was two sessions and I was out of school in the winter. I went to day and night sessions. I learned how to ice skate before I learned how to roller skate. That was the first time. That’s the first thing I learned how to do was ice skate.

Nick Mays [01:19:07] You said there were sports fields for the kids and young people.

Mike Tucker [01:19:11] We had little league baseball, football, basketball. I mean, it was something for you to do with swimming, tennis. It was, it was something for you to do every season. So we were busy. You know, after football, we went straight to basketball at the ymca. YMCA went straight there on Saturday mornings, played football, ice skating. We had multiple parks where we could play basketball, tennis court. I mean, we had. This city had everything you can think of. There was nothing that you can got on ice cream shop on Hayden Avenue. On Hayden, it was an ice cream shop (inaudible). It had everything to see the city just. It’s like I woke up and it was like, I’m like, when did this happen and how.

Nick Mays [01:20:04] So we’re going to pivot again. Get your reflections on revitalizations and the future. What is, what’s your perspective on revitalization efforts having or excuse me, happening now? External efforts, including developments like Circle East project.

Mike Tucker [01:20:31] Like I’ve always said, people are having a problem with this receivership of the state. I, I think it’s a great thing. A lot of people think, well, they’re selling the city. And I, I don’t think they’re actually selling the city. I think that they see that East Cleveland is a gold mine. I’m going be quite honest with you. Anytime you can come to a place where you can’t get no worse, and it’s always a great opportunity for growth. And that’s what business people do. They see growth and they develop it. With this revitalization they’re going through in this receivership, it gives the state the opportunity to allocate these funds to where it needs to be to rebuild the city. We’ve had several administrations who fail to do that. I mean, the world have seen yet officials going to jail for stealing money, misappropriation of funds. You had your police department 15 to 16 of those guys getting indicted. What else can you do? I think that the citizens that are mad about the receivership, I don’t think they really understand the meaning behind it. If you really for the city, you will want the city to get back to work. They’re building new homes. Well, they’re selling. They’re selling out the city. What would you think the other politicians did? They sold us that they stole from the city. So, I mean, I welcome it. Like.

Nick Mays [01:22:21] What makes you hopeful or what concerns do you have about these changes?

Mike Tucker [01:22:28] I don’t have any concerns. I see the city going in the right direction. I see growth and I see people who see a vision that maybe the citizens don’t see. They have an idea of what they want East Cleveland to be and the powers to be. So they’re not doing this without knowing that this is what the end result is going to be. So they have to understand that people don’t take a gamble on stuff like this unless they sure that once we get involved with this, this is going to be the end result. Like this city will be able to. To function and have growth again. So they have a vision and they have an end result of a vision or where they know it’s going to be. It should be. I just think these people are just. Some of the citizens are just. They just don’t know, you know, they’re not knowledgeable what receivership is. They could have somebody stealing the city, but the city’s been stolen from us anyway.

Nick Mays [01:23:33] What does responsible revitalization look like? You from looks like from your point of view is that, you know, for example, East Clevelanders having a seat at the table. Yeah, absolutely. They’ll finally get a chance to have a say. If you look on Euclid and Superior, they build a Dunkin Donuts. This is. This is the type of business that you need in the city. You need those type of businesses. Dunkin Donut is not going out of business. You need other taxable income that way. You need businesses to come in. No city can run without prominent businesses in here for tax base. You don’t get a great tax base from your citizens. You don’t get a lot of that. You need these businesses to come in and believe that they can grow here, that they can develop and move forward and help the city. So you need these businesses, man. And people just have to understand that it’s time. The main thing is people don’t like change. You can get used to something for so long that you think it’s normal. Like this is not normal living. Like you shouldn’t live on a street with only two houses. That’s not normal. Like you shouldn’t live next to empty lots, you know, where kids can’t go outside and play or they don’t have playgrounds. That’s not normal living. You know, I think they just don’t have a vision and understanding what, how you should be living. You shouldn’t be living like this. You shouldn’t ride down streets and see 20 tires and trash everywhere and mattresses. That’s not how you should be living. You know, so it’s just, I think they just don’t like, they’re afraid of change.

Nick Mays [01:25:18] When you, when you think about the future of East Cleveland, what are you most want to see happen in the next decade?

Mike Tucker [01:25:25] I would like to see more families come back here. I like to see these homes to, to be rehabbed or refurbished and get, make this more of a family orientated city man, more of a community based engagement type city. Like we need to get the family structure back and we need to bring people back into. You can’t, the city can’t function. Like the population here is very low, the percentage is low. But you need people to come back, to move back, to give them a reason to move back. Just like you have people that move to Twinsburg and they move there for a reason. Better school system, more the neighborhood is safer or they have better amenities. That’s reasons why people move. But if you can get that here, then you have people move back here, you give them tax breaks, abatement breaks on how houses and for building here. It’s a lot of things that you could do with a city that’s dilapidated like this. This, this is the worst that you can get. It can’t get no worse than this. So you can only go up from here.

Nick Mays [01:26:40] Final two questions. What, what motivates you, motivates your continued commitment? Is a business leader, mentor, you know, just a community person involved in a community. What, what motivates you to.

Mike Tucker [01:26:54] I believe in my city. I love for my city and I’m. And I’m just here to do what I can do to help. That’s all. That’s what, that’s what I’m here for. I could have been like several others. You got some people who just leave East Cleveland. That’s it. I don’t care nothing about the city. I went, I lived there. So what I mean, I mean, and it’s okay because some people are like that. You have people that, that I’ve graduated with that’s all. Their purpose was to graduate, and I don’t ever want to see these people again. I used to preach this all the time when I was president of my reunion committee. Like, you got some people that don’t care about this. Like, they just. Their purpose was to go to school and graduate. Never see you again in life. That’s just. That’s just how life is. Sometimes some people are just not in tune with this part of their life no more. Like, that’s that. I don’t care nothing about that no more.

[01:27:48] And it’s okay, you know. It’s like a needle in a haystack.

Nick Mays [01:27:57] And then finally, when people look back at Mr. Mike Tucker, what do you. What do you hope they’ll remember about your. Your contributions to East Cleveland?

Mike Tucker [01:28:10] I was 100% true to the city. I gave me, you know, which is more valuable than any monetary thing. I cared and I did what I could do while I was here in this city. I mean, that’s what I want. This dude was a good dude. He helped people. He’s a humble dude. He did what he could do. You know, I’m always. I got people classes calling me all the time. I need help. I got you. You know, my wife, like, you. You just. You can’t do everything I said, I know, but I’m gonna do what I’m calling. You know, sometimes she wrestle with that. Like, you just. You just can’t. I say, look, this is what I was called to do. Like, I’m not fighting against this. Like, if they need me to help and I can do it, I’mma help. She just said, well, you know what? All right. I said, I mean, it’s just me, you know, they called me on vacation. They called me. She, like, I said, I can’t. Look, these people don’t know I’m on vacation. They still still want to get some. They want to know something. Wow. I don’t know how I became that guy, like, where people just say, man, call him. I’ve had council people say, well, you need to get in contact with this dude. Like, I’m not the. Okay. He’ll tell you what direction to go in with this long reunion stuff. Like, around the reunion time, my phone is constantly ringing. Like, it’s just off the chain, just ringing nonstop. But that’s what I signed up for.

Nick Mays [01:29:47] Wow. Well put. Mr. Mike Tucker, thank you for your contribution to this oral history project. Thank you for sharing your story. And we’re rapped.

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