Abstract
Artist and retired art teacher Malcolm Brown discusses his life and career as an artist. Brown describes the ideas and inspiration behind his landscape and seascape paintings, and he details the opening and continued operation of the Malcolm Brown Gallery. The artist discusses his early work for the Cleveland-based American Greetings Corporation, the company's trademark style and themes, and the importance of his employment there to his development as an artist. After leaving American Greetings, Brown went on to teach art at Shaker Heights High School, an experience he discusses in detail, and to which he credits his ability to support a family and continue to produce his own art. Brown briefly discusses the impact of race on his art and life.
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Interviewee
Brown, Malcolm (interviewee)
Interviewer
Busta, William (interviewer)
Project
Cleveland Artists Foundation
Date
10-28-2008
Document Type
Oral History
Duration
47 minutes
Recommended Citation
"Malcolm Brown Interview, 28 October 2008" (2008). Cleveland Regional Oral History Collection. Interview 901018.
https://engagedscholarship.csuohio.edu/crohc000/245
Transcript
William Busta [00:00:02] Okay, Malcolm, this is Bill Busta. And could you just tell me what your name is?
Malcolm Brown [00:00:09] Malcolm Brown.
William Busta [00:00:10] And where were you born?
Malcolm Brown [00:00:11] Born in Virginia.
William Busta [00:00:13] Whereabouts in Virginia?
Malcolm Brown [00:00:14] Charlottesville, up in the mountains. I’m a country boy.
William Busta [00:00:20] And the university’s there as well?
Malcolm Brown [00:00:22] Yeah, the University of Virginia is a very historic place and the place has really grown now. I mean, with the university there and lots of people and something else, it’s very historic.
William Busta [00:00:37] When you were in- How old were- I just want to sort of get a little bit of- When did you move to Cleveland?
Malcolm Brown [00:00:44] I moved to Cleveland in 1969. No, earlier than that. I’m sorry, school back, ’60, ’63. But I’ve been here since. I’ve been here a long time. 30, 40 years now.
William Busta [00:01:05] And you were how old when you moved here?
Malcolm Brown [00:01:08] In my 30s. Okay, in the 30s. Yeah.
William Busta [00:01:12] And when you- When you- So you grew up in Virginia?
Malcolm Brown [00:01:16] Yes.
William Busta [00:01:18] And let’s start with the question I had discussed before. When did you first realize you had artistic ability? Was there a moment you can think of?
Malcolm Brown [00:01:27] Well, early in high school, I did some artwork and my art teacher realized that I had some artistic ability. And they always assigned me to do various projects with the school paper and some other things like that. But- and it came very easy for me, the artistic stuff, and I enjoyed doing it and it was very nice, very good.
William Busta [00:02:10] And other students recognize this in you as well?
Malcolm Brown [00:02:13] Oh, yes. Oh, yeah. And throughout my high school career, I always been involved with the school paper and other things, doing other things for different people throughout the school, murals and so forth and so forth.
William Busta [00:02:34] Did you. Was there a point at which you realized that you were an artist and you were you. That you had an aspiration that this was going to be your life?
Malcolm Brown [00:02:45] Not until after maybe 12th, 10th, 11th, 12th grade, I sort of realized that I had some art ability. And at that point I said, I would like to major in art, become an artist. Become an artist. But during those days in Virginia, there was not much that, you know, being an artist, you couldn’t- There was not much opportunity to do art. And I said maybe art education would be the right thing to get into. So I eventually ended up in teaching, and that’s really how I got started.
William Busta [00:03:40] So when you went to college, you knew that you were going to college to study art education.
Malcolm Brown [00:03:50] And this sort of gelled into other things like design, and drawing, and so forth. And I had some art. Two art teachers that were very influential in my art career. One was from India and another guy was from New Jersey. And I’m a twin. So my brother and myself were art majors.
William Busta [00:04:24] Were you fraternal twins or were you identical twins?
Malcolm Brown [00:04:27] Identical twins. Okay, so there’s another one that looks just like me. So during most of my art career at Virginia State College, that’s where I went to school, Virginia State College. I played in the band also. I was a music major. Not a music major, but I played in the band. But I enjoyed doing art. And I had a good teacher from New York. Her name was Helen Hester. She was very influential with my career as far as an art career. And let me see, in the ’50s, I was in high school, college in the ’50s, and I graduated and ended up in Cleveland, Ohio. And when I first came to Cleveland, I didn’t have a job. So I got a job at American Greetings. And that was where I ran into a lot of artists from different parts of the country. And that’s how I got, really got started with meeting Fred Leach. There was another artist that was outstanding floral painter. I can’t think of his name.
William Busta [00:06:28] Why did you come to Cleveland?
Malcolm Brown [00:06:30] Well, I was just looking for a job, looking for employment. Okay. And I mentioned as, I didn’t mention that I worked at the studio for- Where was it now? It was TV station. I worked at the TV station for a while there. I was there for a while prior to going to American Greetings. Is that American Greetings? Where things sort of took off for me.
William Busta [00:07:06] There are a lot of good- A lot of good artists worked there.
Malcolm Brown [00:07:09] Yeah, yeah. And it was sort of a take-off point for me because I- There was a lot of artists there. Fred Leach, Paul Dennis. And I can’t think of the guy’s name that was a floral painter. You might know him. Sort of outstanding floral artists.
William Busta [00:07:29] I’m sure I do, but I don’t. The name- The name isn’t coming to me either.
Erin Bell [00:07:35] Just interrupt for a moment. Just a reminder about the tape.
Malcolm Brown [00:07:38] Okay. Okay. The-
William Busta [00:07:44] When you were at- Let’s see. So do you feel who are who or what- Let’s go start over. Who or what helped you most in your growth as an artist to develop a style, to develop, to become the artist that you feel that you did become? Was it from high school or was it American Greetings a period of growth?
Malcolm Brown [00:08:07] Oh, yeah. More so after I got to Cleveland. I got to Cleveland where things really developed. And then going to American Greetings and working there, that was excellent experience. It was a good experience and really enjoyed it. And I met a lot of different artists who worked in various areas of the card organization and it was there I started to develop painting landscapes, seascapes and so forth. Those were things got going for me. And my main medium was watercolor. And watercolor was very easy for me, for some reason, as a tough medium to work in. But for me it was very easy. And I had a lot of success in that area.
William Busta [00:09:20] What were you doing at American Greetings?
Malcolm Brown [00:09:22] I was in the card area that- What do you call it now? It’s not, there are several areas of divisions there, but it was mostly florals, landscapes and so forth. And I was in that division. They were divided up into. I can’t think of the name of those divisions, but there were several of them. But I was in- And we went through a program also there. We went through a program there, a training program. Prior to- After I got there, there was a training program. And then they put us on the new reproducing cards and so forth.
William Busta [00:10:20] So they tried to train you to be the type of artist that they wanted you to be.
Malcolm Brown [00:10:24] Yes. In order to- And they wanted you to work in their style. You had to develop what they were saying. And there’s card companies, you know, the card companies. There are various card companies around the country. Hallmark, Hallmark and, right, Hallmark and so forth. And American Greetings had their style and you- And they sort of tried to get you to develop and work and use their colors and their style, their look. There’s a certain look that they wanted you to produce. But it was very good for me, good experience over the years to develop my interest. And all along, while we were doing this, there were art shows, all kinds of events that you could enter to win prizes and so forth. And that was where I got started, also winning prizes, and entering shows, and so forth.
William Busta [00:11:41] Did you ever feel that? Did you get to a point where you felt that either you didn’t want to work in their style or that you had a type of work you did at home that was different from their style?
Malcolm Brown [00:11:53] Yes. I only was there for two years, but the main thing I wanted to do was to get a job in teaching. So after I stayed there for a while, stopped working and started teaching at Patrick Henry Junior High School. I was there one year, and then I got a job at Shaker Heights High School. And from there until 2002, I was there for 30 years.
William Busta [00:12:35] It’s a long career in one school, but that’s what you wanted to do. You wanted to be a teacher or did you ever want to be just, you wanted to be an artist. Did you ever think, well, someday I’d like not to teach and just paint?
Malcolm Brown [00:12:52] Yeah. In a way, I’m glad that I did the art teaching first so that I have something to fall back on because you never know what’s going to happen. And I got married, raising family, so, you know, I had to keep, you know, bringing food on the table, so I had to work. So but along with my- I was able to do artwork and work also. So it was sort of a double thing. And then in 1980, we opened the gallery. See, we used to travel. I used to travel to before I even thought about going to the galleries. We used to go to various shows around the country. Pismo Beach, shows in New York, around different shows around the country.
William Busta [00:13:55] Where you would have a booth? [crosstalk] Or shows where you would have a booth?
Malcolm Brown [00:13:59] And I enjoy doing that. So in 1980, we decided to just settle down a little bit. Stopped moving around a little bit. When we opened the gallery in 1980. And what we did, we showed a lot of people from outside of Cleveland. And we met a lady from New York. Her name was June Kelly, and she has a gallery in New York. And we got to know her. And through meeting and knowing her, we got to meet a lot of artists like Bearden, Jacob Lawrence, Elizabeth Catlett and all those. We were introduced to all those various artists from around the country.
William Busta [00:15:01] How did you meet June Kelly?
Malcolm Brown [00:15:06] Well, after we opened. After we opened, we sort of made some contact with various people in New York City. And I’m trying to think how we got here.
William Busta [00:15:28] But it started as a professional relationship where you contacted her about showing some of the artists. Well, June Kelly certainly has been unique, unfortunately. And has been a leading dealer for artists who have been African American when very few other galleries would, would work with them.
Malcolm Brown [00:15:56] Yeah, she had a good reputation around with people. She knew a lot of people. And that was where we first met Bearden. I met Bearden and we got together and we were at the Virginia Museum of Fine Arts in Virginia there. And that was how we got ahold of him. And from that association, we just- Things just mushroomed. We met a lot of interesting- We introduced a lot of interesting people around the country.
William Busta [00:16:38] Did your work change a lot after the gallery, after you, Ernestine, your wife and you opened the art gallery when you had a chance to meet people like Romare Bearden?
Malcolm Brown [00:16:50] Not really. Still, I was during my landscapes, but, moving around the various places I did was influenced by a lot of people. And I like Bearden’s work, but mainly, I was mainly a landscape person. And it was hard for me to get away from that. But I was sort of abstract. I was not really tight- Not a really tight working artist. I was very free and loose and that way. And I had an interesting style that I developed, but so. And that particular style sort of followed me ’til now.
William Busta [00:18:11] What interested you about landscapes? Why did that?
Malcolm Brown [00:18:15] I think because I’m from the country, from Virginia, from rural areas of the country. And I was looking at- And I used to like to do old buildings, shacks and interesting looking things, and create interesting concepts from looking at certain things.
William Busta [00:18:38] When you were a child, did you live out on a farm or did you live in a-
Malcolm Brown [00:18:42] No, no, it was just in Virginia. It was a lot of my cousins and uncles and aunts, and we lived in an area there. No, we didn’t raise any cattle or anything, but we had chickens and pigs.
William Busta [00:19:05] But it’s more. Was a rural area where you.
Malcolm Brown [00:19:08] Yeah, it’s right outside of Charlottesville. Right, right. Outskirts of Charlottesville.
William Busta [00:19:15] So do you feel- You still feel sort of identified with that type of landscape? I mean, you’re not- You’re not making paintings of Shaker Heights houses?
Malcolm Brown [00:19:24] No, no. I always wanted to travel. You know, the last show I had was from the Caribbean, Caribbean Fantasy. But I always wanted to get away and go places. And I still want to do it, but I still like to get away.
William Busta [00:19:48] I’ve noticed that with a lot of. If you look at the history of art, certainly that’s one of the things artists do, is they go to some very interesting and beautiful place and they pretend they’re working.
Malcolm Brown [00:20:01] You know, Jamaica, Saint-Martin was the last place that I visited, and I enjoy going there and looking at the places and sort of trying to. What I’d like to do next is go to Provence, go to some other parts of. Go to Italy. I’ve never been to Italy. Of course, time is running out for me.
William Busta [00:20:33] When you were in the Caribbean, were you painting? Is the subject matter changed? Were you still doing landscapes or did you go to seascapes as well?
Malcolm Brown [00:20:43] Well, right. In Saint-Martin, Jamaica was mostly city areas with mostly landscapes. Yeah. But the subject matter was just different. And then Jamaica was similar.
William Busta [00:21:09] Who are. I guess we talked about what helped you in your growth of your career as an artist. Did you think. Did your formal art education help you or hurt you in finding your own style and finding what you wanted to do as an artist?
Malcolm Brown [00:21:27] Yeah, even before I started, I used to do a lot of old shacks and houses and buildings. And then when I moved to Ohio, Cleveland, and began to travel back down to the Saint-Martin area. Not Saint-Martin, but Charleston area and Virginia Beach. That area did a lot of seascapes. But going to those areas, I think- I don’t- I think that going different places. I would stick mostly with the seascapes and the landscapes and so forth.
William Busta [00:22:42] What did you- Did you- Was it- Is it an intuitive approach when you’re painting, or do you have- Do you have some ideas that you, some sort of intellectual program that you’re trying to accomplish? Are you trying to respond directly to what you’re seeing? Where is the artist in that sort of matrix that involves something that you see, something that’s out there and something that winds up on the piece of paper?
Malcolm Brown [00:23:16] Yeah, my approach is sort of semi-abstract, and I like to work with less. I believe in less is more, doing less. And I think about the view as a stage, you know, with frontal and middle view and so forth. And in that manner, I am more semi abstract, very loose, very free in approach to the subject. I’m not much of a detail person. I like to transpose and give you a different look.
William Busta [00:24:13] And do you have an idea of when people look at your work and they tell you how much they like it, which I’m sure it happens. What do they say that they like about it? What’s the response?
Malcolm Brown [00:24:28] Well, they like the method that I use. The approach to the subject matter not being totally realistic of so much detail there. Give you a different look, different feel, different feel. And different look when you look at it. And it has feeling when you see it.
William Busta [00:24:54] Sort of emotional response. Sort of do peaceful or stormy or little- some of both.
Malcolm Brown [00:25:03] Some of both. It depends on what it is. At one time, I used to do a lot of gray, moody looking. Then I got into more color. I began to use more color, which is now I’m using a lot more color than I did when I first started it. I don’t know what the reason was, but I was more abstract and more patterny at the beginning. And as things developed, sort of changed.
William Busta [00:25:42] What obstacles- What are the largest obstacles that you have faced as an artist in the development of your career or in the development of your work?
Malcolm Brown [00:25:55] Well, not a great deal. Well, there was. In the South when I was there, there was not much opportunity for artists. And until I got here, things changed a little bit, and I began to- But will you repeat that again? You said-
William Busta [00:26:26] I said what were the- Were there any obstacles that you faced in becoming an artist or in advancing your career as an artist?
Malcolm Brown [00:26:34] Well, not really. I have- Over the years, I’ve sort of been successful with winning prizes and people and going to art shows and selling some things. It’s been good, and meeting the right people and they putting me in contact with the right people to see.
William Busta [00:27:09] For different people, it’s a different thing. Virgie Patton always talks about raising a, was it five, seven, however many children it was, trying to find just room to make art.
Malcolm Brown [00:27:19] Yeah, you know, I have three kids and all of them- My daughter is the one that had some art ability and she went to Ohio State and got her degree in art education, but she’s not working into it now. She had to do something else. She started raising the family.
William Busta [00:27:49] Your twin brother is.
Malcolm Brown [00:27:51] Yeah, well, he was an art major also, but later in life he decided to go into the military. So, he retired as a colonel and he lives in Virginia, where there’s a lot of military bases down in that area.
William Busta [00:28:16] So at some point he stopped making art.
Malcolm Brown [00:28:19] Right, right.
William Busta [00:28:20] Well, that’s a big question. There’s always a lot of reasons to stop making art.
Malcolm Brown [00:28:29] Yeah. Slowed down for me now, you know, with the economy the way it is now, I don’t- I’ve slowed down. I’m not doing as much as I used to do because sales are not like it was and everything is on a decline. So.
William Busta [00:28:53] What do you feel your most important accomplishment has been as an artist?
Malcolm Brown [00:29:01] Well, you know, able to sell my work, win some prizes, get some notoriety and experience some success along with some, you know, sometimes you don’t get any shows, but it’s been a lot of fun. And I’ve met a lot of interesting people over the years, the various artists who’ve come to the gallery, and it’s just been interesting, really interesting rides and so forth.
William Busta [00:29:50] Well, let’s talk specifically about the gallery. Was it you and your wife Ernestine opened the Malcolm Brown Gallery you set in 1980? What was the reason that you did that?
Malcolm Brown [00:30:05] Well, we were getting tired of running around and we decided and we met a lot of people and we said, let’s try it out. And we thought we had some things going for us, and so we decided to open it up. And the major thing that helped us, I think meeting the right people at the right time and, going a different direction, we didn’t- We didn’t have a lot of- At the beginning, we were- We had a lot of artists, local artists, and we sort of abandoned it and went in a different direction because- And reason we did that because we met a lot of people who knew some people on the outside. And that sort of got us interested. And it’s been an interesting for us for a number of years, even until now. Right now I’m doing more things on the Internet.
William Busta [00:31:36] Really? Doing sales on the Internet. You’re involved with that?
Malcolm Brown [00:31:40] Right now I need to do more. The last sale I made was on the Internet.
William Busta [00:31:48] Okay. Just to finish with a few more things about the gallery. So the original purpose of the gallery was to sell your work.
Malcolm Brown [00:31:59] Yeah.
William Busta [00:32:00] And then you started to sell other work as well.
Malcolm Brown [00:32:02] It got to the point where I was doing less, you know, I was suffering a little bit. A little bit. But it’s been good because I’ve met a lot of people, a lot of people over the years. A lot of interesting people. Interesting people from various places.
William Busta [00:32:31] You say that you’ve been working on the. You’ve been selling things through the Internet. Are these people who already know your work or these people. These people that have first seen it, have first seen it there?
Malcolm Brown [00:32:44] Yeah, and what we’ve done also over the years, I’ve invested, collected- I have an enormous collection of art of other people. I didn’t know that, but I got a lot. A lot of. A lot of Beardens, Jacob Lawrence Cadets. A lot of artwork that I’ve collected. And I have an arsenal of work that I’m been holding on to.
William Busta [00:33:19] Oh, all the artists.
Malcolm Brown [00:33:23] Some things I bought from other artists and some things I’ve gotten from, you know, Mo Brooker shows with us. Mo Brooker, we have some of his things. In fact, I have two Mo. A huge Mo Brooker in my house. Large. But over the years, we have accumulated a lot of interesting things.
William Busta [00:33:53] Now, the artists that you mentioned collecting and what you and Ernestine have shown are all African American. What is there about that work that especially attracted you?
Malcolm Brown [00:34:09] Well, it was. Well, what we did. There were a lot of artists that were doing very well that we got a hold of, and we knew that down the road, later on they would be successful, like Catlett. You know, Catlett had a show at the museum. Bearden showed at the museum. And we sort of had shows when the museum was having. They were at the museum. We would have a show at the same time at our gallery, which was good.
William Busta [00:34:56] And the museum bought that Bearden through the gallery. Was the gallery involved? They had. They purchased that large Bearden painting or collage?
Malcolm Brown [00:35:06] No, no.
William Busta [00:35:07] That was involved somehow?
Malcolm Brown [00:35:09] No, but no, we had several. There have been several attempts, but we haven’t done anything with museum.
William Busta [00:35:27] That’s always tough.
Malcolm Brown [00:35:28] Right, Right.
William Busta [00:35:29] It’s always tough.
Malcolm Brown [00:35:30] But I, I wanted- I had one in- They had one of my pieces in that collection.
William Busta [00:35:36] How did they acquire that piece?
Malcolm Brown [00:35:40] The lady who came to the gallery in the May show, I had two. I’ve been in two May shows since I’ve been here. And the second May show, she bought this piece. It was 60, 40 x 60. And she donated to the museum collection. Can’t think of her name, but she’s Cleveland.
William Busta [00:36:09] Now. When you were teaching and talk a moment about your teaching career, was there any talent that, that you. Any students of yours that you felt you nurtured and that you’re especially proud of?
Malcolm Brown [00:36:22] Yes, there were. There’s quite a few. I don’t know what. Do you know any of the teachers at Shaker? Jim Hoffman and Shaker had a good program, really great program, and a lot of the artists have this, these, the, you know, the shows that they would have.
William Busta [00:36:44] Yes.
Malcolm Brown [00:36:48] Pratt Institute and all the schools, the members we call. I forgot what the name the schools that they come from. And over the years, I’ve developed a lot of interesting kids and a lot of their parents have always come back and buy by something which is. Yeah.
William Busta [00:37:17] Have you. Are there any of the. Your students that you’ve kept up with over the years and stayed in contact?
Malcolm Brown [00:37:23] Yeah, there’s. There’s one fella. Is it not Pratt, but Risdy, Rhode.
William Busta [00:37:33] Island School of Design.
Malcolm Brown [00:37:34] He teaches there now. And I get letters every once in a while from various students around the country.
William Busta [00:37:46] They’ve kept up as hard as- Do you have anything else to say about any other direction? Anything I should have been asking you or talking to you about your work?
Malcolm Brown [00:37:59] Well, let me see. I think you’ve covered everything. I think you’ve covered just about.
William Busta [00:38:10] Okay, well, I mean, the question that I’ve been through.
Malcolm Brown [00:38:15] These are collects.
William Busta [00:38:16] Yeah, I saw the list of collections that you’ve been in. You know, there’s always that question about what it takes to be and maintain a career as an artist. And I know there’s one joke that people tell that it takes a village to support an artist.
Malcolm Brown [00:38:40] It’s tough business. It’s tough business, and it’s tough to do. And I’m glad that that sort of was doing something else at the same time I was doing. It really helped to not be able to have to be a true artist and, you know, go off to myself and just rely on the art.
William Busta [00:39:17] A lot of artists, I know that they wind up with having one or two people who’ve collected a lot of their work that Ever happened with you? There’s people who just got a lot of pieces, right?
Malcolm Brown [00:39:28] Yeah, right. Right now there’s some. There’s several people in various areas that just keeps buying things, keeps us going, which is good. We’ve developed that over the years, so that’s a good thing.
William Busta [00:39:58] Well, thank you very much. This is going to be a nice show and really appreciate you coming down here. Do you have any- Do you have any questions?
Erin Bell [00:40:07] I can, if you would like.
William Busta [00:40:09] Sure, sure.
Erin Bell [00:40:09] Well, I was actually wondering, looking back on your teaching career, how you handle it, if you see a student that clearly has talent. I mean, surely you were probably that student at one point. So how did that influence the way you handled it as a teacher?
Malcolm Brown [00:40:29] Well, if I see someone that’s really outstanding, I try to help them and try to encourage them to develop more and get more things done in the shows and so forth like that. That’s the main thing. There’s been a lot of them that have been through Shaker, Shaker High School that have done well.
Erin Bell [00:41:04] Can you think of any specific students where they just- They weren’t confident in their abilities or they were involved in other things that were taken away from that focus on art?
Malcolm Brown [00:41:18] Not really. In most cases, if they’re in that program, they really are focused on trying to get some things done. There are not too many of them that fall by the wayside.
Erin Bell [00:41:47] And one last thing. Following up on what Bill said about it takes a village to raise an artist, do you see Internet sales as a way to get around a kind of weak economy here in Cleveland?
Malcolm Brown [00:42:00] Yeah, that seems, you know, when things not. Things are not going well and they can’t reach you, you know, they are all cold and say, let me see what you got on the Internet. I think it’s the way. I think it’s the way of wave, new wave that’s going to start developing the Internet because it’s fast, it’s quick, and once we have a show, they can see everything you got, especially if it’s some good things.
Erin Bell [00:42:40] And do you then have to keep up a website?
Malcolm Brown [00:42:44] Yeah, yeah.
William Busta [00:42:44] Do you do that?
Malcolm Brown [00:42:45] Oh, yeah, yeah. I don’t. I’m not doing- I’m not producing that much. And Cleveland is not a area that moves. New York. June Kelly in New York has. She does something every month, several times, and you wouldn’t believe how much work. More things are going on there than in here. We’re sort of laid back. It’s not as active.
William Busta [00:43:23] That’s true. New York City markets to the world we market to northeast Ohio. It’s a smaller market.
Malcolm Brown [00:43:32] Yeah. So that helps them. And it takes the money to. Takes cash. It’s expensive, really expensive.
Erin Bell [00:43:50] And maybe, maybe one more and then get out of here. Do you find landscapes in and around Cleveland that kind of appeal to your rural background and your desire to find places to get away to?
Malcolm Brown [00:44:07] You know, here, most of the seascapes and I haven’t been able to find that much. I go travel like Nags Head, Virginia Beach, North Carolina, various other places, Maine, get up, get away. And, and people like to look. When they look at things, they like to say, oh, this is from certain place, a certain area. They buy places. That’s what happens.
William Busta [00:44:53] Okay, thank you very much.
Malcolm Brown [00:44:55] Okay.
William Busta [00:44:56] May I keep the copy of the resume?
Malcolm Brown [00:44:59] Yeah, yeah.
William Busta [00:45:00] Okay, good. Because we’ll be able to put this with the file for the show.
Malcolm Brown [00:45:04] Okay.
William Busta [00:45:04] And we’ll- Because we’re collecting those too. This is very- This is very useful. Thank you.
Malcolm Brown [00:45:11] Thank you. Well, I didn’t know what was going to be. Had trouble finding direction in. You got lost.
William Busta [00:45:30] I did too. I got lost as well.
Erin Bell [00:45:32] Pretty confusing campus, especially right now.
William Busta [00:45:36] A lot of things.
Malcolm Brown [00:45:43] The art world right now is kind of quiet. Everything is quiet.
William Busta [00:45:49] Everything’s going to be quiet for a while. Well, we help with people, see what, what’s going to happen next. We’re all anxious about that a little bit.
Malcolm Brown [00:46:02] My daughter lives in Chicago. In fact, I know some of the people. Obama’s associates came to the gallery for the catless show. Okay. All righty. Okay. Thank you again.
William Busta [00:46:30] Nice to see you. Yes. Okay, great.
Malcolm Brown [00:46:41] Thank you.
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