Abstract
In this 2005 interview, Alan Jones, Executive Secretary of the Ancient Accepted Scottish Rite of the Valley of Cleveland (32nd Degree Masons) discusses his career as a Mason; the history of the Masonic orders in Cleveland and Ohio; and the history of the Cleveland Masonic and Performance Arts Center located at East 36th and Euclid Avenue. Jones first discusses his family's long involvement in Masonic organizations in Pittsburgh, and then his own introduction to Masonic orders in Cleveland as an adult in the 1980s. Jones identifies and discusses a number of Masonic orders, past and present, that used the building at East 36th and Euclid, which was built in 1918. Jones also provides a good description of the Masonic way of life and why it continues to be attractive to men living in Cleveland and its suburbs. Finally, Jones discusses the challenges that the Masons have had maintaining the building at East 36th and Euclid over the years.
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Interviewee
Jones, Alan (interviewee)
Interviewer
McCafferty, David (interviewer)
Project
History 400
Date
12-8-2005
Document Type
Oral History
Duration
64 minutes
Recommended Citation
"Alan Jones Interview, 2005" (2005). Cleveland Regional Oral History Collection. Interview 400020.
https://engagedscholarship.csuohio.edu/crohc000/43
Transcript
David McCafferty [00:00:03] Any questions before we get started?
Alan Jones [00:00:04] No, not really.
David McCafferty [00:00:05] Okay, cool. It is pretty straightforward. Well, this is David McCafferty. I’ll be doing the interview today with Mr. Alan Jones. Today is No– I’m sorry, December the 8th of 2005, and we are in the building of Cleveland State University. This is all history for the Euclid Corridor History Project. Mr. Jones, thanks for joining us today.
Alan Jones [00:00:30] You’re welcome.
David McCafferty [00:00:31] Just got a bunch of questions here I want to ask you, and let’s start off with the start of the basics. Where were you born?
Alan Jones [00:00:38] I was born in Kodiak, Alaska, on September 1, 1955. My dad was stationed there during the Korean War. 30 days later, we came home. So I was raised in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.
David McCafferty [00:00:52] When did you move to Cleveland?
Alan Jones [00:00:54] I moved to Cleveland after I graduated from college in 1977. I’ve been here ever since.
David McCafferty [00:00:58] Where’d you go to college?
Alan Jones [00:01:00] Went to college at Allegheny College in Meadville, Pennsylvania. An economics major.
David McCafferty [00:01:06] Did you graduate there?
Alan Jones [00:01:07] Graduated – it’s a liberal arts school – graduated with a BS in economics in 1977. Also was a four-year letterman on the baseball team.
David McCafferty [00:01:17] Like baseball?
Alan Jones [00:01:18] Love baseball.
David McCafferty [00:1:20] So you came to Cleveland in the–
Alan Jones [00:1:23] I had graduated in June of ’77 and took a position with a company here in Cleveland. Joseph T. Ryerson and Son Incorporated, steel company, located on East 55th street. Started August 1, 1977. Been here ever since.
David McCafferty [00:1:36] Where do you live?
Alan Jones [00:1:38] Now I live in Richfield, Ohio. Tell everybody, it’s the best kept secret south of Cleveland. When we moved here, we moved to Bedford. Spent two years in Bedford and about three years in North Olmsted before we bought a home in Richfield. And we bought that home in 1981, and we’re still there.
David McCafferty [00:01:56] What do you do for the company you work for?
Alan Jones [00:01:58] Well, I am, I guess. I like to tell people I’m a professional Mason. In May of 2004, I was hired to be the executive secretary of the Ancient Accepted Scottish Rite, Valley of Cleveland. We call ourselves now the 32nd degree Masons because the general public has a better understanding of that as opposed to Scottish Rite. They think we’re from Scotland and we’re not. But I took over for the executive secretary, John Youngblood, who was retiring. And I’m also the secretary of my lodge, which is also a paid position. So I have two things I do. Both of them are being secretary for Masonic group, and I pretty much run the building. That’s why the board of trustees hires me, pays me. We have that rather large building at the corner of 36th and Euclid. And I’m the decision maker on the things that go on in a building that’s 88 years old.
David McCafferty [00:03:01] Things like renovations?
Alan Jones [00:03:03] Renovations. When the sump pumps fail and the boiler rooms flood when wind damage and rain damage and tenant damage. And people rent the facility and keeping the sidewalks clean. I manage the custodial staff. We have a 2,000-seat auditorium that we rent out to groups. Aside from using ourselves, as a matter of fact, tonight, Red An Orchestra has a concert there. The Cleveland Orchestra used to record there. Deutsche Gramophone records there. So there’s lots of things going on in the building. And I’m the. The manager of the entire staff as well as the responsible person from the building. I’m a member of the board of trustees and attend the monthly board meetings. And I’m secretary of that body as well.
David McCafferty [00:03:52] So it’s a full-time job?
Alan Jones [00:03:53] Full-time job. I would say 40 hours a week, but I haven’t had a week that slow in a while.
David McCafferty [00:04:00] When did you yourself become a FreeMason?
Alan Jones [00:04:03] I joined the Masons. I petitioned lodge in the fall of 1984. I joined a lodge called Newburgh Lodge number 379. That was originated in 1865 or 1866 in the, I’m sorry, 1868, in the Newburgh Heights area. They eventually in the mid seventies, sold the building that they were in and moved to Brecksville. Living in Richfield, it became a very close place for me to join. And I was actually raised a master Mason on January 11, 1985. And I went on to be the master of my lodge in 1990. I was the master, which is another word for president or guy in charge. And you go through a progression of offices and become the presiding officer and then back into the group with the rest of them. I belong to a lot of the various Masonic groups. I actually joined the Scottish Rite, Valley of Cleveland in April of 1986. The Scottish Rite takes in members twice a year and in the spring and in the fall. And they named their classes after either prominent Masons, prominent men, or, our last class was named in honor of our military heroes. My class was the Jacob Kamm class. The Kamm family, of course, is the Kamm’s Corners family. So Jacob was who my class was named after in 1986.
David McCafferty [00:05:38] The Kamm’s Corners in Cleveland.
Alan Jones [00:05:39] Yes. I’m sorry.
David McCafferty [00:05:43] Why Masonry? What is it about Freemasonry that attracted you or interested you enough to petition to join a lodge?
Alan Jones [00:05:52] That question for me is easily answered. And it was a familial thing. My father and his brothers were Masons. My mother’s father and brother were Masons. I have great aunts and great-great aunt. Im sorry, great uncles and great-great uncles who were Masons. When I was 14 years old, my father came into my room when I was doing my homework and handed me a petition for the Order of DeMolay, which is the Masonic youth group, and told me, sign here. You know, you don’t have to pay. I’ll pay. You’re joining whether you like it or not. And if you don’t like it, you don’t have to go. And if you do like it, I’ll get you to the meetings. And I liked it. And I became the presiding officer of DeMolay in 1972. And didn’t join quickly after college, after I became age eligible, because I had moved to Cleveland. And as I stated, my family lived in Pittsburgh. And I always thought someday I’d be able to go home and join my dad’s lodge. My father passed away in 1980. And then that thought disappeared. And I was actually in the fall of ’83, I was at a softball banquet. Being a big baseball player, I started to play softball when I came to Cleveland. And I was in an awards banquet getting an all-star trophy. And one of the guys on my team, his father was a Mason and a member of Newburgh Lodge. And that’s how that connection came.
David McCafferty [00:07:22] What was it like when you were a kid in the youth Mason group? What is it that you guys did? What is it that you said you enjoyed it? What is it that you enjoyed?
Alan Jones [00:07:29] DeMolay, like Masonry, is a fraternity for young men now from the ages of twelve to twenty. And it used to be fourteen to twenty, they’ve actually lowered the age requirements. And much like a fraternity in college, they had their secret handshakes and passwords and it’s a brotherhood. It was the feeling of belonging and doing things for a common purpose. And then, of course, being a kid, we did things with the girls youth groups and there were fun activities, sports, things of that nature. And the camaraderie is really what I liked. They really do stress the brotherhood part of it. And DeMolay has ideals for living that I knew were right. One of the things that happens when you join the order of DeMolay, when you’ve gone through there are two degrees. And when you’ve gotten both degrees, at its conclusion, they have a ceremony and it’s called the flower talk. And this is hard for me to talk about. This is the real reason that I stayed in DeMolay and became active then flower talk. One of the things that DeMolay tries to instill in the young man is a respect for womanhood and more importantly, for motherhood. And the flower talk talks about how your mother takes care of you from before the time you’re born until the time when you don’t want her to take care of you anymore. It says things like, no matter how low you fall in life, you’ll never fall below her love. And no matter how high or successful you are, you never exceed her secret hopes for you. And when you’re done, they present you with a rose. And they tell you that you get a white rose if your mother has passed away. And they tell you to keep it in her memory and think of her every time you see it. If your mother’s alive, as most are, you get a red rose. And they tell you take it home and give it to her and tell her you love her. Which at 14 you probably don’t do very much. And they say someday you’ll find it in a Bible, in a special book. And they’re really referring to that time when your mother’s gone. And I knew it was true. I knew that the stuff about your mother was true. And I said, this is all right. And I still get emotional about it even today because it meant so much to me. And I’m an advisor in DeMolay now. I’m one of the adults that helps for that very reason. For that very reason.
David McCafferty [00:10:19] How big was DeMolay? Was there a lot of kids involved? I mean, obviously it had a very great impact upon you. Did it have, do you think, as big an impact on the other people that you were with?
Alan Jones [00:10:29] Actually no. My DeMolay chapter was very weak at the time. I went through with about eight or ten young men similarly aged as me. And actually most of whom attended my church. So it was almost an extension of the church youth group in a way. But I was really one of the less fortunate ones. A lot of my Masonic friends who are my age or somewhat older had much larger DeMolay chapters. Particularly in Ohio. Ohio is the largest DeMolay jurisdiction in the world. Barely ahead of northern California. And here in Ohio, my son’s DeMolay chapter would have at times thirty to thirty-five young men in attendance. Where mine never had more than twelve or fourteen. His experience that way has actually been better than mine, and actually he’s currently the state master counselor of Ohio DeMolay. So he’s the head of Ohio. DeMolay at this moment.
David McCafferty [00:11:26] Very nice. When you joined the Masonic Temple or the Scottish Rite specifically on Euclid Avenue. How big was the membership at the time?
Alan Jones [00:11:37] At that time, in 1986 it was probably in the neighborhood of 8,000 in Cleveland. I couldn’t tell, quote you for the entire state as I can today at that time. But in Cleveland, roughly 8000 Cleveland fell below 10,000 in ’73, so I’m thinking right around eight currently. Currently, it’s roughly 4,700.
David McCafferty [00:12:03] Why has there been such a decline in your opinions from even to the time you joined till now?
Alan Jones [00:12:11] Basically several factors. One is we’ve lost a generation. Masonry really boomed post-1945. After World War II, when the soldiers came home, the Scottish Rite went from 4,500 members to 14,000 in four years. Those men joined in droves, remembering that the Nazis, of course, banned Masonry in the areas that they held. So all over the country, really all over the world, it boomed. And then what we’re experiencing now is those members are becoming older and passing away. And as technology changed, and it used to be, in those days, the lodge was the hub of the entertainment center for the local small communities. All these Masons did everything in their lodges, the dances and all that kind of stuff. And, of course, as things have changed over the years, and television and all the digital and all the things to occupy time, as well as the fact that nowadays, you know, you’re in two income family homes instead of one, the divorce rates are higher, and all of those things have adversely affected us. An organization that has remained rather stoic over the years and hasn’t really changed with the times. It takes a unanimous ballot to get in, and it takes a certain amount of dedication to join. They’ve reduced some of those requirements over the years in an attempt to change with the times, but it still takes a fair amount of effort to become a Mason. It’s not as expensive as it once was, because the fees have, in essence, stayed the same, while inflation has made them of less expense. But that, coupled with the fact that, like I said, we’ve kind of lost a generation. We’re getting new members now, today, who are telling us, my grandfather was a Mason, but my dad wasn’t, and I wanted to find out why. And they do some investigation, of course. They have the Internet and whatnot. And we are. Although it’s still declining in numbers, we are once again starting to get young men joining Masonry. My individual lodge, which is now Theodore Breck. There’s been a lot of mergers of the lodges as the memberships have declined, much like a business would do. And my lodge merged in 1998 with the other lodge that was located in Brecksville. Last five members we have taken in. The oldest one is forty, and the youngest one is nineteen. So there are younger men joining now. I think that in the next ten years, the steady decline will cease.
David McCafferty [00:15:03] You had said that the people joining now some of them are because of a missed generation, looking to find out what their grandfathers had done before them. Is that the main reason that people are joining now? Is that the main underlying theme, or is there something else? Because you had just mentioned that things like divorce rate, the Internet, tv, tends to detract away from that kind of dedication.
Alan Jones [00:15:21] I think. And you can look at what’s happened to Masonry, much like what’s happened to churches. If you were to poll individual churches, I think you’d see that their attendance is down, that people don’t go to church the way they used to. And although Masonry is in no way a religion, it does espouse personal religious beliefs. In other words, you are told, whatever your religion is, it’s a good thing to practice it. You must have a belief in God to join the Masons, and it must be one God. You must be a monotheist. You can be a Jew, a Muslim, a Christian. It doesn’t matter, so long as there’s only one God involved. Masonry doesn’t care what his name is. Whatever religion you are, they encourage you to practice it, and they espouse good morals, and they teach good morals and good upright living and the brotherhood of man under the fatherhood of God. Over the years, ’60s, late ’60s, ’70s, when this decline started, as the war in Vietnam ended and the different movements took place and things became more open and more liberal, if you will, a lot of people weren’t really interested in the values that we were teaching and espousing. And now I think that, like all things, like, it’s like in the ’60s, everybody grew their hair, and nowadays you’ll see a lot of people with short hair again, and it’s the same type of thing. It’s gone full circle. And now there are people who are looking for some moral guidance and direction, and I think that’s the other part of the reason. And these young men see what their grandfathers did. And in those days, people didn’t talk about Masonry. As a matter of fact, America is way more open than everybody else. It’s top secret everywhere else. And I think, in my opinion, it’s a lack of understanding. Most of the things that are in Masonry can be found in the Old Testament of the Bible. They’re not secret. Yeah, there’s a secret handshake and a secret password and that type of thing, just like any fraternity has. But most of what’s taught is right in the Bible, in the Old Testament. And so nowadays, people recognize that and are more willing to talk about it. More willing to have public ceremonies where in the old days that would never happen. People were tight lipped. And it’s with all the problems with cults and those types of things. The membership today doesn’t want people to think that that’s where we are or what we’re about. That’s certainly not the case. And if you just read things or look at things or see some of the symbols, it might make you wonder when in fact they are just that. Just symbols taken from bygone eras. Most of them very ancient and not necessarily used the way they were in the old days.
David McCafferty [00:18:21] What has it meant to you personally to be a Freemason? What has it done for you? How has it enhanced your life personally and professionally?
Alan Jones [00:18:31] Professionally, obviously, as a professional Mason now it’s going to be the end of my career. My intention is to retire as the secretary of the valley of Cleveland. When I get to that age personally, the morals that it teaches, the moral way of living. And again, it’s a guideline. It’s not saying that every Mason lives that way. It’s a goal that you strive for. Some of my best friends and most trusted friends in life are Masons. People looking for that kind of moral direction are generally fairly like minded. And so it’s easy to make friends there. Friends that you can trust literally with anything. When my wife and I had to make our wills the first time and we had a young child. Some of the people in the line of who would get our young child if something would cause our demise together. Weren’t necessarily family. They were Masons because I trusted them. I knew that if they got the insurance money, they’d use it for my child and not for themselves. I didn’t even have to think about that. And I think I’m a better person as a result. And also, every Mason is entitled to a funeral and a Masonic funeral service. And having been the presiding officer, I’ve conducted many of those services. And one of the things that we say in the Masonic, and it’s a public ceremony, one of the things we say in the Masonic service is that you need to overcome your fear of death. If you know, if you believe. If you really believe in a God that says that there’s life after death, then you really shouldn’t be afraid. And that should be very calming to you. And in fact, it’s been very calming to me. I look at the things that they teach and the goals that they set, if you will. And in some ways, more than my religion, it’s giving me a very calming effect. I no longer worry about that day when I take my last breath, that I’m confident that something else will happen. So that’s really the primary reason. It really has given me a lot of inner peace.
David McCafferty [00:21:01] You said that you’ve. That some of your most trusted friends are Masons. Has the makeup of people who are applying for Freemasonry changed even in the time from when you first applied? Different walks of life, different ethnic backgrounds?Has that changed at all?
Alan Jones [00:21:17] Yes, definitely. When you go back, even I joined in 1986, was when I was, or, I’m sorry, 1985. Prior to that, in the sixties, in the early sixties, late fifties, the unwritten rule was if you weren’t a Mason, you weren’t doing business in this country on a professional level. And as the fraternity started to decline in numbers, so did that perceived reality. Whether it was true or not, I don’t know. And certainly Masonry teachers don’t try to use this for your own personal gain in business. That’s not what it’s for. And as a Mason, I never did. I never tried to get anything extra from a brother simply because I was a brother and he was a brother. What does happen, though, is because of that trust factor. When you do business with another Mason, you have a tendency to trust him to be upright and honest is what you fully expect and is what you typically get. It’s a good guideline in that way. Nowadays, there are much more blue collar people that have gotten into Masonry. Not that they didn’t back in those days, but there’s more now. Used to be, there weren’t very many Roman Catholics in Masonry, and that wasn’t Masonry so much as it was the Catholic Church. In the 1700s, the pope decreed that joining a Masonic organization was grounds for, when they kick him out, excommunication. And that order has actually never been rescinded. However, of course, America being rogue in the Catholic Church, they do pretty much things the way they want and not necessarily the way the Vatican decrees. Here, we encourage Roman Catholics to talk to their priests before they join. And most of the priests will tell them, I’m supposed to tell you it’s bad, but it’s really not. It’s okay. Go ahead. And nowadays, there’s a fair amount of Roman Catholics. Ohio’s archaic. We’re the largest Masonic organization in the world. Ohio has more Masons than any other grand lodge jurisdiction in the world, including England. And we have about 125,000 in Ohio. So Ohio tends to be rather conservative. There’s not a lot of integration in Ohio in terms of color. Part of the reason for that is there’s another Masonic group called the Prince Hall Masons, which are primarily African Americans. Oh, 6, 8, 10 years ago, we started to recognize each other. In other words, Prince hall has come to our meetings. We can go to their meetings and we recognize each other as Masons here. In 2004, in June, for the first time ever, as far as anyone knows, the prince halls of Ohio and the Freemasons of Ohio did the third degree, which is called the master Mason degree, together at the Masonic Temple in Cleveland. And the work was split between the two groups. I actually gave the masterMason degree lecture. Each degree in Masonry in Ohio has a 15 to 20 minutes speech which is done from memory attached to it, which recapitulates what the degree is about. And then further explains the secret symbols, if you will. And that was the first time in, there were probably 700 people to witness that in our auditorium. And that was the first time to anyone’s knowledge. So we’re not terribly integrated. Even still, African Americans still have a tendency to join the Prince Halls as opposed to our lodges. And of course, you’re supposed to join a lodge in your local area where you live. Would make it easier for you to attend as opposed to driving all over creation. And then the appendant groups tend to be more centrally located, like the Scottish Rite being downtown.
David McCafferty [00:25:17] You had said that Ohio has the most amount of Masons anywhere else in the world. How important is the Scottish Rite lodge on Euclid Avenue?
Alan Jones [00:25:26] Excuse me. [cough] Actually, very. Scottish Rite Masonry in Ohio is also the largest Scottish Rite state. Scottish Rite was a creation of the United States despite its name. And there are 55,000 Scottish Rite Masons in the state of Ohio. Our governing body is called the Northern Masonic Jurisdiction. And it covers fifteen states, basically New England, as far south as Pennsylvania and Ohio, and as far west as Wisconsin. The other thirty-five states are in what’s called the Southern Jurisdiction. The Northern Masonic Jurisdiction has 220,000 members. The Southern, about 240,000 members. So just under 500,000 in the United States. But if you look at it, we have 55,000 out of 220. We are fully a quarter of the entire Northern Masonic Jurisdiction. So Ohio is quite large. And as far as the Scottish Rite goes, it doesn’t really give us any additional power. Ohio doesn’t rule the roost. It’s kind of like the Senate, where California and New York don’t rule because they each only have two reps. We do have one or two more representatives than the other states, but we’re not able to. The voting members of the Supreme Council are numbered forty-nine and we have five. So although we have 25% of the membership, we really only have about 12% of the voting rights.
David McCafferty [00:26:57] Let’s stick with the building for a minute since we’re talking about the importance of it. It was built in. It started being built in 1919 and finished in 1921, is that right?
Alan Jones [00:27:07] No, it was, the way it was built was built in two sessions. And it was done that way intentionally. The property was acquired. The beginnings of the negotiation started as early as 1915, internally setting up the whole idea. The auditorium was actually built in 1918. And the auditorium was standing alone in the beginning. Shortly after its completion, they started to build the building in front of the auditorium, actually south of the auditorium. And it was built exactly as designed in the sense that they wanted to build a what they call four story, it’s really more like seven because they have mezzanine levels, but they had specific uses for those, each floor for different bodies. And it was all the Masons in Cleveland area that got together to build that building, not just the Scottish Rite Masons. In 1915, or actually 1918 when construction started, the Scottish Rite was composed of about 1800 members. And in 1920, when the cornerstone was laid on the front of the building, the Scottish Rite was composed about 3300 members and steadily increased after the building of that building. It was designed by plan. The organ was actually installed, I believe, in 1919, although it’s a 1918 model organ. But I think it was 1919 before it actually got delivered and installed. It was ordered in October of 1918, the big concert organ in the pipe organ in the auditorium. But it was planned that way. That was the plan from the beginning. All the Masonic bodies owned stock in the building corporation, the temple company that built the building and the Scottish Rite in 1918 gave $100,000 for that purpose and was a big shareholder. And needless to say, back in 1918, $100,000 was a lot of money as opposed to what it would be today. But that was the plan with the building and we still have the original blueprints of the building.
David McCafferty [00:29:13] Why was it built there at 3615 Euclid Avenue? Why is it built there?
Alan Jones [00:29:18] At the time that was actually the suburbs. People considered Cleveland city proper to end at East 9th Street. And that was an area which was known as Millionaires’ Row. And actually it was the Wick property that was acquired. I think they originally went for the Parcel’s property at 30th and Euclid. Another family had owned and that actually got voted down internally. They had built a building in 1885 at the corner of I want to say West 6th and Superior. It could be east 6th. I get them confused, but it’s where the federal building is now today. That was the very first Masonic building built by the Masons in Cleveland. And when they built it, it was designed to serve its purpose for at least 60 years. We’ll need this to say just 20 years, 25 years later. They actually first started to consider building another building in 1907. So they fought amongst themselves, if you will, not literally, but verbally, about whether or not the need was there. And of course, you have the people saying, well, we built this building for 60 years and it’s only been 20, you know, so very quickly, they outgrew the building they had built is really what it amounted to. And they wanted to be away from downtown a little bit. And the Millionaires’ Row, the Wick property, the main building, was gone. I don’t know why, but there was a little thing there that they called a ladies’ club. It wasn’t a big, huge building. There wasn’t a lot of demolition that needed to take place. And of course, at the time, it was 35th and Euclid. There was no street there in between. There was no 36th Street. And Chester Avenue was a one-lane road named Douglas. And there weren’t other establishments like that in that area. It was all mansions, if you will. And so that was the plan. Out in the near suburbs, not too far from downtown, a bigger building that will be longer lasting. And in particular, the auditorium. And the auditorium actually was designed with the Cleveland Opera in mind. That’s why the acoustics in that building are so superb. That’s why people come and record there. It really is an acoustically superb building. And it was designed that way because it was going to be the home of the Cleveland Opera. That’s why we have a concert pipe organ and not a theater pipe organ.
David McCafferty [00:31:45] We’ll actually get back to the auditorium in just a second. There’s a couple questions I want to go with that one. You’d mentioned was placed near Millionaires’ Row. Was that to cater to specific people living there? Were there prominent Masons who were living at millionaire’s row at the time?
Alan Jones [00:31:57] There were, but that’s not really the reason. It had to do more with the availability and price of the property in a close proximity to the Cleveland area as opposed to millionaires row itself. It was the best available alternative where they had room to build what they really wanted to build. That was really the driving force as opposed to keeping it near the members. The members lived all over this was all of the Masonic groups, the shrine included. If you look at our building, all of the Masonic primary Masonic groups, aside from the Scottish Rite, the lodge, which would be the square, encompasses with the letter g the symbols of the chapter of Royal ArchMasons, the Council of Royal and select Masons, and the Commandery of Knights Templars. Those symbols all are on the building because it was the home of everything, including the shrine. That symbol is on there too.
David McCafferty [00:32:50] Going back to the auditorium, why was it built first?
Alan Jones [00:32:55] The auditorium is what we, the Scottish Rite, use to actually perform our degrees. So when we make new Scottish Rite members, they go in the auditorium and watch a series of really, what are best described as morality plays, a play with a moral. And the stage is perfect for that. So we could stay in our old building for the administrative purposes and have the degrees in a bigger facility that was obviously being required. And certainly as time went on after the post World War II era, we had classes in excess of 1,000 members. So there were times when that auditorium was full of men becoming Scottish Rite Masons. That’s why it went first. It was the biggest requirement, the biggest necessity, and the other bodies could do their degrees there as well. That’s why it went first.
David McCafferty [00:33:44] So the auditorium was built so that you could take care of the events and rituals that you needed to do. When did The Cleveland Orchestra, the Cleveland Opera, when did that start or why did that start? Other outside groups using the auditorium,
Alan Jones [00:33:55] The opera, I believe, came back in the days when they were building that building. The people who were running the Scottish Rite were people with the name of Brenton D. Babcock. He was once the mayor of Cleveland, people who were of citywide prominence, and they wanted it for the Cleveland Opera. The Cleveland opera didn’t have a place at that time. I don’t think Severance was there. If it was, it wasn’t what it is today. And it was close to downtown in the Scottish Rite. There’s a lot of music in our degrees and things of that nature, and it was a natural fit. We would have put an organ in there anyhow. We use it even today. So I think it was a culture thing. Back in those days. The people who were running the organization were in fact prominent people in the city and in the state, for that matter. And I think that’s why that connection came. The Cleveland Orchestra came later, and they came again because of the superb acoustic quality of the building. I receive emails on a periodic basis. I got an email probably four or five months ago from a guy from Seattle. And he said to me, he has ten cds of the Cleveland Orchestra. And he said, I have five of them that were recorded at the Masonic Auditorium and they’re magical, and the other five are just recordings. Why is that? And I said, because our building is acoustically superb and I am not an engineer. I can’t tell you why, I just know that i
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